Good news for ATXers !!!!!!!!!

[JohnH]

Marbeth:

Yes, I'll throw in two OfficeMax discount coupons just to even things out.

[TaxCPANY]

KC's assurance is a force to be reckoned with, as is ATX's TTO price for providing *everything* under one roof. And, today, I called tech help -- about Preparer info not rolling-over or even F3'ing into Form 990-PF -- and, for the first time this whole, blemished Season, reached someone in only a minute or two. Granted, it took another 20 minutes before she could only promise to call me tomorrow AM after escalating it to the developers -- but, as soon as she recreated the problem on her end, it indeed was escalation, not runaround nor aw shucks, time.

So, by the way, anyone else having this problem with page 13 of Form 990-PF?

VTY, TaxCPANY

[GLJEANNE]

If they want people to renew early, they ought to offer a discount that does more than just cover the obscenely high "shipping" charge!

[joelgilb]

Ok KC, I hear what you and your source are saying, and this has made me feel a little better, BUT....

I just received my 4th or 5th phone call from ATX (also saw that Mel won't be ready next season, thx for the update Mel) BUT I Still have concerns.

Had the bate and switch done to me by another company that bought my tax product won't mention any names, but they make and sell the top low end accounting software which starts with a Q! Received all the same promises and in the end was switched. I ended up purchasing 2 programs that year and never got my money back on the first.

As for the call, ATX promised me over and over that they would not be discontinuing the product, but refuse to give me the basic guarantee I requested as follows:

"If for any reason the ATX product is discontinued in the 2009 (2008 tax returns) season, and CCH is going to switch them to an alternative product in their line, then the customer, at his option may choose to cancel the product and request a full refund"

This should be a NO BRAINER! If they are not discontinuing the product, the have no risk in giving me that Guarantee, because with that guarantee I only have one way to get a refund, if CCH, who has full control here, discontinues the product and attempts to switch me.

Real simple if you ask me.

When I switched to ATX (it was the software I had to pay extra for as I had been renewed byt that other company and couldn't get my refund), I was a substantial drop in price for me. I had been used to paying over $3,000 several years ago. So, what do I save if I renew now, $150.00 maybe? To me $150 is nothing, just insurance.

And if I have to switch there are a few good programs at my old cost + inflation that I will consider.

As for TRX, downloaded it, tried it, T IS CRAP in my opinion. Way to awkward and low level for my needs.

[joelgilb]

Oh, and one more thing.

If we now trust CCH, why don't we close this board and jump back to the ATX community CCH put back up?

I'll answer this one myself.

Because we don't trust them yet!

(ps: ok, well also because Eric did a great job setting this board up)

[kcjenkins]

I agree with basically all you said, Joel. I don't know why they won't give you that promise in writing, since the law would give it to you anyway. But frankly I think it is because no one on the phones has the authority, rather than that they are planning a coup. I do think that their marketing department sucks, big time.

But like you, I was paying around $3500 for the full TAASC program before I switched to ATX. So I'm very conscious that the price is a very fair one for the program we get. And I have been made a lot more comfortable after talking to folks who are actually working on the new program.

I just spent some time with support yesterday, after I got locked out of the support page, and could not get back in. Turned out the problem was that the Activation Code, which is the password to use to change your password, was changed IN THEIR RECORDS. I know it was at their end, because I have the original packing slip with the activation code, which I was using, which did not work. Turned out they had two numbers changed in the 20 number code. Weird.

By the way, one thing I will never do is abandon this board for their board, since they have already shown that they do not consider our needs when it comes to the board.

[joanmcq]

I had the same problem when I got locked out. Activation code they had was not what I had from my packing slip. Although what I had on my packing slip activated my software. off by two numbers.

[Gail in Virginia]

Interesting. I had the same experience. I always save the activation code in case I need to reinstall the software, and yet it did not work when I tried to log on to ATX support. I wonder if they were all different?

I also am leery of growing to depend on ATX's bulletin board after having it jerked out from under me so close to the end of the tax season. I have no reason to think that ERC would do that to me, and every reason to think that ATX might if it suited them to do so.

[BulldogTom]

I think we need to have a contest. Lets all go log into the ATX board, and start posting like we normally do. Lets see who gets banned first? I think I will be gone in the first 20 minutes or 5 posts. I would consider it a badge of honor if my posts caused them to pull the ATX board again.

Remember, only posting like we do here. Polls on if we are staying or leaving, evaluations of other softwares, general chit chat, e-file agony, -- you know, the normal stuff we are posting now.

Tom

Lodi, CA

[JohnH]

I'm not saying this to criticize their revised board, but it seems to me that it hasn't taken off very well. I've posted to it a few times just to more or less keep track of where I left off on the past visit, and it seems there isn't much quality activity on it so far - certainly nothing approaching the quality of the info being posted on this forum. Maybe that's because it's still fairly young, but I suspect it has more to do with people's overall uncertainty & lack of trust of the company.

In any event, there's no reason that I see to become deeply involved with it since we have our own board that isn't subject to the whims of some out-of-touch management team that is subject to throw another tantrum at some point in the future. I agree with Gail - this forum needs to stay active regardless of what happens at the "Official" level. Nothing can beat having some control over the process.

[lydia33]

I,myself, have not posted a blooming thing on the board. My face is still stinging from the slap last year. I do go and read sometimes, but, it is not much there.

[Mel in Hawaii]

Seems as if something like a database import/update basically showed you how they make up their activation code and where the random/check digits are. But of course that really is only good for one year, a smart person would change the activation algorithm every year to avoid piracy.

[BulldogTom]

Mel, are you saying you have enough information to crack the installation codes? You wouldn't be suggesting that all of us buy the PPR and then have you give us a fully functioning MAX program, are you? That would not be right <<wink>> and would be totally unethical <<wink wink>> and would make all of us feel real bad about taking something from CCH that they earned <<cough>>

Don't go reporting me to CCH police, I am just kidding.

Tom

Lodi, CA

[jklcpa]

I think the other board is suffering too because it was started late in the season & all the "regulars" already were on here with no desire to go back. I checked out the official board & recognized a few old names. Most seemed to be those posters that only are there during the season to get their question answered & have no desire to help others or stay around after the season ends.

[zeke]

"Most seemed to be those posters that only are there during the season to get their question answered & have no desire to help others or stay around after the season ends. "

Then they don't get no frikkin bananas!

[kcjenkins]

I just looked at it for the second time, and it's amazing how few questions have more than a couple of responses. Very little activity. Not worth the time. IMO.

[Mel in Hawaii]

Mel, are you saying you have enough information to crack the installation codes? You wouldn't be suggesting that all of us buy the PPR and then have you give us a fully functioning MAX program, are you? That would not be right <<wink>> and would be totally unethical <<wink wink>> and would make all of us feel real bad about taking something from CCH that they earned <<cough>>

Don't go reporting me to CCH police, I am just kidding.

Tom

Lodi, CA

Well, I could always make up my own installation codes as I knew how they are constructed.

I wasn't suggesting that you install something that wasn't purchased, I was basically saying that some person's mistake gave out a lot of information. It was something that I orriginally pointed out when the installation routine was written years ago, but it wasn't considered an important issue back then as GW was a trusting and honest person. I also advocated for changing the install routine yearly to avoid problems with piracy. Granted, the current installation codes are easily traced back to the person who purchased them, so people 'posting' installation codes could easily be prosecuted if need be. But, if someone posted a routine for generating codes, that wouldn't be easily traceable, except for going to the place that it was posted and backtracking. I am not advocating that either, I can easily see CCH sicking many lawyers on that.

Now, I don't know what security measures were undertaken in the last few years, so there may be more ways of tracking illegal installations too, but I don't know them.

[Mel in Hawaii]

Actually, I never thought about it, but the Efiling module would be a dead giveaway for an illegal installation. So I guess changing the installation module wouldn't really matter now.

[kcjenkins]

Yes, today they could give anyone access to the program, with minimal security, because the EFIN is all the 'tracking' they need. And it will soon be required, I expect, by all states, that we efile. Which is a bit scary, if you think of it. If the IRS suspends you, due to some error, you are almost out of business. And don't say that can not happen, I know for a fact it has. Then they took months to admit it and reinstate the preparer.

[Jack from Ohio]

Tracking by EFIN would only apply to the current year installation. All prior years cannot be e-filed.

[joelgilb]

Actually, I never thought about it, but the Efiling module would be a dead giveaway for an illegal installation. So I guess changing the installation module wouldn't really matter now.

Interesting observation Mel. Did you notice that in past years you could use Profit Developers Inc (PDI - http://www.profitdevelopers.com/) for E-filing of returns, but in the 2007 season you could not. I actually used PDI several years ago, because it was cheaper to file the couple of e-files I had that year. Switched to ATX unlimited e-files the next year, when I had built the e-file base back up.

But I did notice that last year PDI dropped support for ATX, but supports CCH's Prosystems FX. My guess is that this way they can monitor who e-files as a check for pirating on ATX, but due to pricing on their premier product (and probably customer base) have no concern over pirating of that software.

[joelgilb]

Tracking by EFIN would only apply to the current year installation. All prior years cannot be e-filed.

And as for old years, I would guess that CCH is not very concerned about losing profit by pirating here. In the past ATX practically gave me their old software (a few years of software for years when I used others - TAASC, so I wouldn't have to use 2 different softwares for back returns), charging basically shipping and handling charges only. They also gave me network codes for some of the old software for free, to allow me to put it on my network.

[joelgilb]

Ok I finally bit the bullet and decided to renew for next year. Did drop my package from Total Tax Office to Max though and considering if I should renew the total tax office later this year.

So Why did I do this.

Did I get my GUARANTEE! (the Justin Wilson guarantee)?

No, afraid not.

Spoke with one of the few that took the transfer from Caribou Maine to Georgia, who suggested that though it was a bad decision, there were offers for others to transfer to GA to consolidate the call center. He assured me (not sure why I finally believed) that not only will the ATX software exist, it had 3 times the user base of Taxwise and they have and have planned substantial upgrades to the product. Including one I have looked for, the ability to automatically have K-1 information transfer to the individual returns.

So, I stopped holding out and made the decision to renew.

Besides, I find that I really don't need technical support that often.

[RJM]

Joel, your comments are softening my resolve to never use a CCH product again ! Still have not tested Drake, but have whittled down all the alternatives to just Drake for testing. If I end up renewing with ATX, will have a continual fear of getting bait-and-switched in December. But, if it happens (seems less likely now, though), I guess I could live with it, or switch to Drake at the last minute.

KC, as far as your comments regarding the programmers' faith in an enduring product, I am not persuaded. Based on the prior whims of CCH exec's, an immediate termination of this product seems very plausible.

Still, I like the ATX value for the cost. If I renew, will probably downgrade from TTO to whatever seems appropriate.

[mcb39]

I renewed Max today. I knew all along that I would renew if it was offered. However, because I respect the opinions and comments of KC and others on this board; I feel much better and more optimistic about it now. TRX called me again today about 5 minutes after I had renewed. Samantha said, "Since we see that you downloaded the program.....etc." The thing is that I never downloaded the program as I never had DSL until two weeks ago. Samantha promised to send me a disk so I could take a look at it. The other thing is that Kathy promised to send me a disk over a month ago and it never arrived. If Samantha delivers, it will go on the pile with the rest for future reference. I feel confident that ATX is everything that I need and more. If they continue, I will be happy as generally the only support that I need is this forum and my research materials. If ATX goes down, I will probably retire. Just thought I would come forward as I have not revealed my intentions to the board; but have been very carefully reading all of the comments that the rest of you have made.