JRS Posted April 23, 2009 Report Share Posted April 23, 2009 Is it possible to set up a poll on where forum members stand on switching to TRX or staying with ATX/CCH? I know I am still pondering the switch, but am still a little quesy about the change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Posted April 23, 2009 Report Share Posted April 23, 2009 Poll added Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kcjenkins Posted April 23, 2009 Report Share Posted April 23, 2009 I understand. I'm leaning strongly toward going with TRX myself, just have one final question, about networking, and then I'll decide. I'm glad I decided to ask more questions, because [understandably] the answers from the CCH salespeople were not completely accurate. They naturally try to scare us into staying with them, but the answers I found from Braedan cleared up my fears. Next I'll have to decide what to do with the $996 that I will save. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Booger Posted April 23, 2009 Report Share Posted April 23, 2009 After reading all of the posts under the TRX portion of the forum, I still don't understand HOW TRX can sell the same software for hundreds less? Would someone please explain? Perplexed Booger Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike D Posted April 23, 2009 Report Share Posted April 23, 2009 After reading all of the posts under the TRX portion of the forum, I still don't understand HOW TRX can sell the same software for hundreds less? Would someone please explain? Perplexed Booger Please see my latest posting under Braedon's thread for up to date important information. Mike Dubin CPA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joelgilb Posted April 23, 2009 Report Share Posted April 23, 2009 I understand. I'm leaning strongly toward going with TRX myself, just have one final question, about networking, and then I'll decide. I'm glad I decided to ask more questions, because [understandably] the answers from the CCH salespeople were not completely accurate. They naturally try to scare us into staying with them, but the answers I found from Braedan cleared up my fears. Next I'll have to decide what to do with the $996 that I will save. Vegas Baby! Oooops I mean "Guru". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kcjenkins Posted April 23, 2009 Report Share Posted April 23, 2009 After reading all of the posts under the TRX portion of the forum, I still don't understand HOW TRX can sell the same software for hundreds less? They buy the program in large 'lots', at wholesale price, basically. Remember, CCH [in fact all software companies] have a fixed cost to develop a program, but selling extra copies does not significantly increase their costs. The main cost that they have, for extra copies, is the support function. So they sell the program themselves, at retail prices, with full support. They also sell to the TRX at wholesale, with all the features, but no support. TRX provides the support for those users. This costs CCH little to do, brings in extra income, and also, to some extent, feeds them new customers, they hope, when some of those new users move up to their premium products. Plus it allows them to attract the low-end user market, without having to appear to cut their prices. TRX can sell it cheaper because they buy it cheaper. But the 'marginal cost' for CCH of these extra copies is basically the cost to print an extra CD. It's similar to GM or Ford selling to Avis or another rental chain at a significant discount over what they sell through dealers. They want to get their cars into the rental market, so that renters will try out their cars and hopefully decide that they like the model enough to change to it the next time they buy a new car. And they can take a lower profit per car, because they don't have to pay commissions on the sale, and don't have as much cost in processing one big sale over processing many single sales. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yardley CPA Posted April 24, 2009 Report Share Posted April 24, 2009 I renewed through TRX this morning. I still have a bit of a queasy feeling but hopefully everything will work out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joelgilb Posted April 24, 2009 Report Share Posted April 24, 2009 They buy the program in large 'lots', at wholesale price, basically. Remember, CCH [in fact all software companies] have a fixed cost to develop a program, but selling extra copies does not significantly increase their costs. The main cost that they have, for extra copies, is the support function. So they sell the program themselves, at retail prices, with full support. They also sell to the TRX at wholesale, with all the features, but no support. TRX provides the support for those users. This costs CCH little to do, brings in extra income, and also, to some extent, feeds them new customers, they hope, when some of those new users move up to their premium products. Plus it allows them to attract the low-end user market, without having to appear to cut their prices. TRX can sell it cheaper because they buy it cheaper. But the 'marginal cost' for CCH of these extra copies is basically the cost to print an extra CD. It's similar to GM or Ford selling to Avis or another rental chain at a significant discount over what they sell through dealers. They want to get their cars into the rental market, so that renters will try out their cars and hopefully decide that they like the model enough to change to it the next time they buy a new car. And they can take a lower profit per car, because they don't have to pay commissions on the sale, and don't have as much cost in processing one big sale over processing many single sales. Of course it is going to backfire somewhat when users of this community, used to paying more switch to TRX. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Booger Posted April 24, 2009 Report Share Posted April 24, 2009 They buy the program in large 'lots', at wholesale price, basically. Remember, CCH [in fact all software companies] have a fixed cost to develop a program, but selling extra copies does not significantly increase their costs. The main cost that they have, for extra copies, is the support function. So they sell the program themselves, at retail prices, with full support. They also sell to the TRX at wholesale, with all the features, but no support. TRX provides the support for those users. This costs CCH little to do, brings in extra income, and also, to some extent, feeds them new customers, they hope, when some of those new users move up to their premium products. Plus it allows them to attract the low-end user market, without having to appear to cut their prices. TRX can sell it cheaper because they buy it cheaper. But the 'marginal cost' for CCH of these extra copies is basically the cost to print an extra CD. It's similar to GM or Ford selling to Avis or another rental chain at a significant discount over what they sell through dealers. They want to get their cars into the rental market, so that renters will try out their cars and hopefully decide that they like the model enough to change to it the next time they buy a new car. And they can take a lower profit per car, because they don't have to pay commissions on the sale, and don't have as much cost in processing one big sale over processing many single sales. Thanks, KC....now it makes sense. Enlightened Booger Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joel Posted April 24, 2009 Report Share Posted April 24, 2009 I operate a small practice as the only preparer. Last year I switched from ATX to TRX primarily for the lower program cost. I was not totally satisfied with the Tax Works program for 2008 (and I believe TRX also was not satisfied) but never had a problem with getting tech support for the few questions I had. When I had a tax question, I was referred to a tax specialist who promptly gave me the answer. I have been completely satisfied with TRX and in early April renewed again but this time for TRX-ATX as after 5 years using the program before switching I am used to working with ATX. I am looking forward to a good tax season next year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samingeorgia Posted April 24, 2009 Report Share Posted April 24, 2009 Evidently I'm in the minority, but I just can't bring myself to go to TRX. What KC says does make sense, but we all know that big companies like CCH can make very arbitrary decisions with no regard to customers needs. Look at what they did with the message board! Who's to say that if TRX pulls significant money off CCH's bottom line that they won't pull the plug? Or not provide timely updates? We know that these are not under the control of the software company because they are waiting on the IRS and various states to tweak their forms - but how fast the updates come to us sure is under the control of the software companies! OK, maybe they have some kind of "contract" -- while the lawyers argue we out in the field get shafted. Here's an example of how wonderful big companies are: I have used tax return covers from "Accountant's Supply House" for years. This year on March 15, I called to get some more covers; the lady answered "Deluxe". Well, it seems that Deluxe check printers has bought ASH. Of course I wasn't in the computer (WHY NOT???) but she said they would send me a catalog. March 31, no catalog. I called back and was told that they couldn't get covers or catalogs for 20 days (WHY???). I didn't need a calculator to determine that March 31 plus 20 days is beyond April 15th! As of yesterday (April 23) there is no catalog in my possession. From now on, I'll have the covers printed locally -- don't care about the cost. I want to be able to hold somebody's feet to the fire. The same with software: if CCH cashed my check, somebody at CCH will give me some answers if (when) something goes wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Margaret CPA in OH Posted April 24, 2009 Report Share Posted April 24, 2009 You make some salient points, samingeorgia. I am still waffling myself tending to the belt and suspenders category. I would like to save $400 but, but.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bstaxes Posted April 24, 2009 Report Share Posted April 24, 2009 I like the idea of saving money. I am not sure if TRX will allow me to have 2 locations. With ATX I could have 3 locations without any problems with licensing. Still reading what everyone is saying and still on the fence. I usual renew early but last year it was Dec when I renewed. Also wondering what Mel is doing. I guess I will keep reading and seeing what others are doing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneInAlabama Posted April 24, 2009 Report Share Posted April 24, 2009 I will probably go with the $299 program. It has everything I need except for 1099 efile. The $699 program has the 1099 efile, but I think I can probablly find a 1099 efile program for a lot less than $400. If anyone knows of such a program, please let us know. I use Medlin for W2s. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NECPA in NEBRASKA Posted April 24, 2009 Report Share Posted April 24, 2009 I would really like to save $900, but I have a lot of reservations. I know that they are checking on whether the research materials will be offered in print and online forms. I like to have my books in paper form. I can take them or grab them off of the shelf immediately. Too many times, I've tried to get in to Kleinrock and they have been having a problem on the website. I really worry, too that this will make CCH, just give up on ATX and I love the software. Bonnie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samingeorgia Posted April 24, 2009 Report Share Posted April 24, 2009 In the interest of full disclosure, I think I should state that I cannot prove that it is the Deluxe check printing company that bought out ASH or some other company with the name "Deluxe" in the title. Went to the P.O. today -- still no catalog. Don't want to get us sued or aything.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joelgilb Posted April 24, 2009 Report Share Posted April 24, 2009 For those of you that don't want to switch to TRX after how CCH handled us in the ATX takeover and don't want to save the money. Well I am just confused. But, what I can say is thanks for making sure CCH is profitable enough for those of us that choose to switch for better pricing, and better support. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Margaret CPA in OH Posted April 24, 2009 Report Share Posted April 24, 2009 I was told by Braeden that ATX has something like 35,000 users. Our little group making this switch will apparently not affect the CCH bottom line negatively to any substantial degree, I think. They may benefit from shifting support away although, on the whole, our main support is from this forum, I venture to say. It looks to be another exciting year! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zeke Posted April 24, 2009 Report Share Posted April 24, 2009 I was told by Braeden that ATX has something like 35,000 users. Our little group making this switch will apparently not affect the CCH bottom line negatively to any substantial degree, I think. They may benefit from shifting support away although, on the whole, our main support is from this forum, I venture to say. It looks to be another exciting year! If CCH is bringing pressure on TRX regarding use of the name ATX and also asking Braeden to curtail communications with this board, I feel that we now have the attention of those that so rudely terminated the "Official" ATX community last year. I have no doubt that the powers that be will not allow TRX to steal existing customers in the future. BUT for this year, I think they just might be stuck and have to suck it up. I consider it condign indeed that a large percentage of our 934 members may actually switch to TRX. z Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David1980 Posted April 25, 2009 Report Share Posted April 25, 2009 Actually the price of the software itself may not have as much impact as you would think. A lot of the revenue for a tax software company is through bank product fees. The ~$30 bank fee often gets a decent rebate amount to the tax software provider. See this thread for more evidence of that: http://www.atxcommunity.com/index.php?show...l=bank+products You'll note the emphasis on bank products there. In fact, some tax software sales people will ask you pretty quick how many bank products you did last year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catherine Posted April 25, 2009 Report Share Posted April 25, 2009 I am suddenly re-thinking the jump to TRX. Not for anything TRX has said or done (or CCH, either, for that matter). But I just remembered that the price of my web site is a special discount for ATX customers. If I go to TRX, I'm not at all sure that I won't then have a jump in my web site price. I did the math; if they hike my web site price, then my savings drops from $340 (the difference between the TRX price for TTO, and the price I'd pay CCH for Max, because I won't buy TTO from them), down to about $80. For $80, it's barely worth the bother. Although the tech support might still be better from TRX (how could it be substantially worse?), I get all my support right here anyway. Ponder, ponder, agonize, ponder some more, consider, ruminate, excogitate...... :dunno: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCL Posted April 25, 2009 Report Share Posted April 25, 2009 Evidently I'm in the minority, but I just can't bring myself to go to TRX. What KC says does make sense, but we all know that big companies like CCH can make very arbitrary decisions with no regard to customers needs. Look at what they did with the message board! Who's to say that if TRX pulls significant money off CCH's bottom line that they won't pull the plug? Or not provide timely updates? We know that these are not under the control of the software company because they are waiting on the IRS and various states to tweak their forms - but how fast the updates come to us sure is under the control of the software companies! OK, maybe they have some kind of "contract" -- while the lawyers argue we out in the field get shafted... My two cents follows saminga's reservations...while kc's analysis makes sense for "the too good to be true" scenario. 1) Braeden from TRX says TRX has "premier accts division" status with CCH. For how long?...one, two, or five years? We don't have a guarantee from TRX that ATX will be delivered in 2010. I guess there is a money back guarantee, except I don't understand the practical effect of the guarentee. 2)TRX sold Orrtax/Intellitax(?) at a discount. CCH bought Orrtax/Intellitax and converted preparers to TaxWise (although, it seems some were able to get an ATX product). CCH had previously bought ATX and TaxWise...hmmmm? 3)Until CCH buys TRX (or pulls the plug on TRX, as saminga says), it looks like a deal to go with TRX...while the "too good to be true" senario lasts. Even after one year, the alternative would be to go back to CCH/ATX (hopefully ATX), until the merged ATX/TaxWise product comes along in a few years (as Sasha from CCH has explained). 4) Then, at what price for a small tax practice like me? Stay tuned...news at 11:00. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Margaret CPA in OH Posted April 25, 2009 Report Share Posted April 25, 2009 For me the refund guarantee would allow me to purchase directly from ATX should TRX be unable to deliver. The most I would lose would be the big $111 discount for this year. If CCH pulls the plug for TRX after next tax season, I can always go back then. It may end up the $400 I save this year to get more than I want/need will get returned, in part, next year to CCH. As you say, stay tuned... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kcjenkins Posted April 25, 2009 Report Share Posted April 25, 2009 According to Braeden, TRX has a five year contract with CCH at this time. So it seems likely that whatever happens with the various programs, TRX will have some product to deliver for the next five years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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