The Tax Book

[Joel]

The UPS man just delivered my copy of the Tax Book. Guess I should start thinking about 2009 taxes.

[OldJack]

I just received my 1040 Quickfinder Handbook and my Small Business Quickfinder Handbook.

Quickfinder publications are by the tax publishers Thomson Reuters. They are a huge tax publisher that publishes other tax books such as the RIA Federal Tax Handbook and RIA Federal Tax full series of Books. I have always found Quickfinder publications better than the tax book. The last I knew the tax book company has less than a dozen employees to research and write their book.

I have no investment or connection (other than as a customer) to Quickfinder or related companies.

[JohnH]

OldJack makes good points, but then there are counterpoints. The Tax Book is written by people who actually work in the tax business and thus they have unique insights into the needs of tax pros. They also offer a variety of combinations of the publication and an excellent CD. Online updates are standard and The Tax Book sponsors a top-notch forum whose participants include the authors of the publication. None of this takes anything away from QuickFinder, but simply points out that each publication occupies a valuable place in our business. I have at various times in the past subscribed to each, and at one time both, and find each of them first-rate publications.

I also have no investment or connection (other than as a customer), to either publication.

[Kea]

I've used Quickfinders for the past 10 years and have been happy with them. Last summer I wanted to get the small business edition and they still wanted the full price. I checked with The Tax Book and they were willing to sell it for $18. It's been a good reference.

I'm now spending a lot more time traveling and don't really have the space to carry 10 old books with me. I checked with both companies about getting the old CDs and found I could only get 2008. Does anyone have old CDs that I could get a copy of? I would want to check copyright laws, first. But if neither company has them available, I don't see how they could complain too much.

Thanks

[tilt]

Isn't the Tax Book put out by folks who used to work for Quickfinders?

[Joel]

Isn't the Tax Book put out by folks who used to work for Quickfinders?

Tilt,

Yes they were originally employees of Quickfinders.

[OldJack]

>>Yes they were originally employees of Quickfinders.<<

They were fired by Quickfinder. Makes you wonder about them.

I also have in the past bought both books. I have never had disagreement with Quickfinders opinions, but I have in the past disagreed with the tax book author and they have admitted I was right. The tax book is a good reference, just not as complete or as good as others.

[jainen]

>>The Tax Book is written by people who actually work in the tax business and thus they have unique insights into the needs of tax pros<<

I always thought this was an odd marketing claim. Are they implying that "Competitor Q" is written by a used car salesman? I mean, is tax practice just a sideline for TaxBook authors, or is publishing their book the sideline? And are their "unique insights" related to tax pros in a national franchise, a big accounting firm, or a solo office? 'Cause they sure don't put those insights into a book about tax practice, like Quickfinder does. And QF even offers a companion volume all about my state, California. And lots of other great books on accounting and planning for tax professionals,

If you don't trust Quickfinder's professional legal researchers, it is easy to check because they fill their book with citations--PLR's and court rulings as well as code regs. And it truly lives up to its name because whatever you are looking for, you can find it quickly. When the TaxBook first came out I was impressed by their more detailed index. It turned out they had to do that because it's not so easy to find what you need where you expect it.

Still, there was one thing I didn't like in my 15 year Quickfinder subscription. In 2004 when the qualified child rules were expanded from EIC to all five benefits, I thought they had a weak explanation for Head of Household.

[Lion EA]

Authors You've Trusted for Years

Straight Talk

In December of 2003, Practitioner's Publishing Company (PPC), a division of Thomson Corporation, acquired the privately held Quickfinder® company from a family in Minnesota. The success of Quickfinder® up to that time was due in a significant part to the efforts of the Quickfinder® editorial staff. At the time of acquisition, the entire Quickfinder® editorial staff consisted of five authors. Initially, four of these authors signed on with PPC/Quickfinder®, and continued writing for Quickfinder®.

In February of 2005, a new company called Tax Materials, Incorporated (TMI) opened its doors in Minnesota. The four authors who had been hired by PPC/Quickfinder® after the acquisition separated from that company and rejoined their colleague. The group of five authors joined forces to create a new line of products called TheTaxBook series, competing with the PPC owned Quickfinder®. They were successful again!

Our authors know what is important in a fast-answer reference book because all of them are practicing tax professionals. This is a claim that cannot be made by most of our competitors.

TheTaxBook guarantees coverage of any applicable tax law change which occurs on or before December 1st in the year the book is written (books begin shipping by December 15th on a first in first out basis). If you do not feel our books met your expectations through tax season, simply return them on April 15th for a full refund - no questions asked.

[OldJack]

Our authors know what is important in a fast-answer reference book because all of them are practicing tax professionals. This is a claim that cannot be made by most of our competitors.

I know as a practicing tax professional with more years experience than any one of them, I certainly would not have time to author a good tax book. I find it amazing that these 5 people think they do a good job just because they have experience. If you compare their books for prior years you will notice that basically they make little or no changes from year to year. That has not been the case with congress. I used their book for several years in addition to Quickfinder, but I don't know about their current year publication as I have not ordered it.

[JohnH]

>>The Tax Book is written by people who actually work in the tax business and thus they have unique insights into the needs of tax pros<<

I always thought this was an odd marketing claim. Are they implying that "Competitor Q" is written by a used car salesman? I mean, is tax practice just a sideline for TaxBook authors, or is publishing their book the sideline? And are their "unique insights" related to tax pros in a national franchise, a big accounting firm, or a solo office? 'Cause they sure don't put those insights into a book about tax practice, like Quickfinder does. And QF even offers a companion volume all about my state, California. And lots of other great books on accounting and planning for tax professionals,

If you don't trust Quickfinder's professional legal researchers, it is easy to check because they fill their book with citations--PLR's and court rulings as well as code regs. And it truly lives up to its name because whatever you are looking for, you can find it quickly. When the TaxBook first came out I was impressed by their more detailed index. It turned out they had to do that because it's not so easy to find what you need where you expect it.

Still, there was one thing I didn't like in my 15 year Quickfinder subscription. In 2004 when the qualified child rules were expanded from EIC to all five benefits, I thought they had a weak explanation for Head of Household.

I don't see it as an odd marketing claim at all, and I spend a fair amount of my own time in the marketing field. Any statement of this sort can either be meaningless fluff or it may be significant, depending upon what the end product looks like. WIth The Tax Book, I like the end product. None of this is intended to imply that Quickfinder isn't also a fine product.

[mcb39]

I did receive a free copy of The Tax Book this past summer, along with CD; as a marketing tool. I did look at it and did use it. However, perhaps because it is the "Combined" version, I found it cumbersome and difficult to use. I have used Quickfinder 1040, Small Business and All States for many years and will again this year. I did find The Tax Book to be an interesting product and have little basis to judge it. However, I have much faith in Quickfinder and will not change at this point. FWIW

[Evan S. Golar]

What Jainen and Old Jack are NOT telling you is that a few years ago - due to abuse on The Tax Book webboard - they were banned from future use.

Why don't they tell you the truth?

[jainen]

>>Jainen and Old Jack are NOT telling you<<

Both OldJack and I have posted this information many times on this forum. A half dozen of the most active members of the TaxBook forum were blocked during a change several years ago. No reason was ever given, but it was apparently related to several threads on the political implications of tax policy, a common theme that is handled pretty elegantly here. If you wonder what our positions are, you need only review a few days posting. I hope you would find my open skepticism to be deeply rooted in high ethical standards for client service and an indefatigable pursuit of statutory authority.

Well, I can freely admit my review of Quickfinder and its competitor are colored by the same bias. It is anybody's guess why the publishers of The Tax Book didn't want such posts.

[JRS]

Though, I sometimes don't agree with you, I do find your "open skepticism to be deeply rooted in high ethical standards for client service and an indefatigable pursuit of statutory authority." AND, I agree, the politics are, "a common theme that is handled pretty elegantly here."

Please stay around during tax season this year!

[taxxcpa]

Isn't the Tax Book put out by folks who used to work for Quickfinders?

A large company took over Quickfinders and required that all employees move from Minnesota to Texas as I understand it, so the employees who wrote the book decided to start their own version and ramain in Minnesota.

As far as I know, both books are about equal in quality. I went with The Tax Book since I am more inclined to trust a company that specializes in one publication than in one that one that engages in a multitude of publications.

The Tax Book's forum seems to have a lot more activity than Quickfinders' forum and the book authors often step in to clarify issues raised like William Tasker used to do for ATX.

[OldJack]

>>Old Jack are NOT telling you is that a few years ago - due to abuse on The Tax Book webboard - they were banned <<

Evan:

Well.. I think Jainen said it pretty fair about the ban. That was many years ago and as Jainen said we have both talked about it on this forum. Since you are new to this board it is reasonable to say that you speak out of ignorance of the facts.

However, I will add, as I implied in my post above, I was banned immediately after I disagreed with Bees Knees (an author) on a tax issue. Truth is he did not want to be shown as being wrong and it is his board. Being banned is meaningless as one can join under a different name. I was told the author made a comment on the board later that I was probably still on using a different name. I have never posted on their board since the ban and have no need to post there. I have other boards that I post on and I did so before their board started.

I resent the statement that the ban was due to my abusing the message board. Especially since you were not even around at the time. Most of us that were banned helped make their board popular when it first started.

My posts above are purely stating my opinion. Your post Evan didn't even state an opinion on the books so why did you post? Are you associated in any manner with the tax book? One thing the moderators of this board have made clear is that personal attacks will not be tolerated.

[JohnH]

The Tax Book editors have chosen to take a hard line on posts that 1) deviate too far from tax matters and 2) violate their interpretation of offensive or rude behavior. I think they're a little over-sensitive in this area because I enjoy wide open discussion and I don't generally take things personally, but they didn't ask my opinion. Their position is that overly aggressive lanugage in posts can drive participants away from their product. They may be right.

Not knowing the specifics of why jainen, Old Jack, and a few others were banned, I have no idea if the Tab Book editors acted fairly or not in their situations. However, I was warned a couple of times and I had the choice to either dial it back or get banned. I decided to play a little more closely by their rules. If my experience with them is typical then it really isn't very complicated - they own the forum, so they get to decide how it's run.

This is one of the many reasons I like this forum so much. We still have rules, but the atmosphere is much more open. We don't have to worry about collateral damage to a product we're trying to sell if someone steps across the line, and as jainen pointed out we have a fairly clear method of labeling a topic when it may be incendiary. I also like this alternative forum because I'd miss the benefit of jainen's and Old Jack's professional input without it.

[Lion EA]

I've used both books and have liked both. After Thomson's takeover, they seemed to branch out into books on bookkeeping and other topics as well as taking topics out of their core books to create new books such as on depreciation. Since that time, I've tried Kleinrock's Quick Answers and The Tax Book in a couple of formats.

I like The Tax Book cites. Just opened to any page, it's Interest Paid -- Itemized Deductions. It starts with Cross References listing such things as the instructions for Schedule A, Form 1098, and Form 4952, and IRS Pubs 535, 550, and 936 giving their full titles too, and IRC section 163. Next are Related Topics giving things like Student loan interest deduction on Tab 12 as well as three others. If I need more than the quick answers, examples, court cases, planning tips, and author's comment, I now know where to look for IRS guidance from the Cross References list. One year I bought the CD; then I just clicked on a Cross Reference to go straight there.

I was used to how to find things in Quickfinders, but I found fewer and fewer answers, examples, commentary, etc., on the issues I encounter as the years went by. I loved the chart they had comparing pension plans. It was designed by TTB authors while they were QF employees, so the copyright belongs to Thomson; and it'll never appear in TTB! Over time, TTB has become more useful to me for quick answers as well as a starting point for research.

[Dan]

The UPS man just delivered my copy of the Tax Book. Guess I should start thinking about 2009 taxes.

What is the web link to the Tax Book that you are talking about? What is the cost?

Thanks for the information!

[tilt]

Wow! I feel dumb. I didn't know there was such controversy.

[Joel]

After all this controversy, can I now withdraw my first post?

[JohnH]

No need to consider withdrawing your post; sometimes a good through discussion just looks like controversy.

If I didn't know about both references, this discussion wold inspire me to check them out.

Or if I used only one of them, I'd consider looking at the other one in order to make a good decision based on my practice needs.

http://www.thetaxbook.com/

http://www.quickfinder.com/

[Evan S. Golar]

To Old Jack - I'm not as ignorant as you think. I had just started logging in to The Tax Book (under a different name) when you and Jainen were banned.

Being banned from a board means some sort of misconduct on your part - otherwise you wouldn't be banned.

What I meant in the post was - I feel Jainen's opinion of The Tax Book was tainted and biased because of his dissatisfaction of being banned from The Tax Book board - so he'd be prone to being critical in commenting on the product.

[mcb39]

I just received an offer from Tenenz for 10% off on The Tax Book......any or all. I already ordered Quickfinder. I think they are both good reliable products for research; but none of us should limit ourselves to just one source. I have found the 1040 Express Answers increasingly helpful in the past couple of years. All told, though, this Community Board is the best research resource that we have.