JohnH

19 minutes ago, Abby Normal said:

Even survivors may have damaged organs for life and experience subsequent problems. That's my biggest worry. Best wishes!

https://www.vox.com/2020/5/8/21251899/coronavirus-long-term-effects-symptoms

Yes, that's a legitimate concern.  Guess I'm going to be on high alert for any unusual symptoms anywhere in my body.  I do happen to have a cardiologist appointment in 3 weeks.  Going to lobby for a little more intensive testing. (I might even finally agree to that angiogram he keeps pushing.)  But whatever the course in the future, it is what it is.  I'm not losing any sleep over it. 

The thing I'm most curious about is whether there's any long-term immunity conferred, and whether it's limited.  I'm gong to get weekly antibody tests, even if I have to pay, for at least the next 6-8 weeks.  But plasma donations might come with free testing - haven't checked that out yet.  If I wind up with immunity that would fit in with my plans to return to Myanmar and India on mission trips early next year, and frankly would have made it all worthwhile.  I suspect those counties are going to be paying special attention to Americans at immigration - maybe even requiring documentation prior to departure..  (That's already happening in Europe) 

Are you one of those who are saying "I don't know anyone who's had COVID-19."?  Well, now you can change that statement.  I thought I'd share with my friends and colleagues on this forum my experience of the past few weeks.  We haven't shared this information beyond a few family members and close friends - haven't even shared it within our church (for some unique reasons)  This is a little long, and probably too much detail.

On June 26 I awoke with a deep cough, slightly sore throat, and low grade fever around 99.1. The next day the fever persisted and I began feeling very tired.  Got tested on June 28.  The next few days were pretty bad with fever bouncing around and peaking at 102.  Dry cough, little or no taste, and general malaise.  Didn't get my results back until July 4, but to no one's surprise I was indeed positive.  The listless life and fevers continue until the night of the 11th, when I awoke at 3 am in a sweat because the fever broke.  The next day I felt much better but then fever began to rise to 102 at bedtime, and broke again around 3 am.  On the 13th day I felt great, and by day 14 one wouldn't have known I'd ever been sick. Today is day 19 and I'm still regaining strength, but feel wonderful. Already had my follow-up test and I'm now negative.  Next steps will be voluntarily testing for antibodies and possibly donating plasma at the Red Cross if they want it.

My wife also tested positive, but she NEVER HAD A SINGLE SYMPTOM.  My doctor wasn't all that surprised and just said "Yeah, she's an asymptomatic carrier.  We see this all the time."

I'm 72, with stable angina, overweight, and I have "reactive airways", which means I get bronchitis easily.  So I just assumed if I got the Wuhan Coronavirus I'd wind up in a hospital, probably on a ventilator, and with a poor prognosis. By the grace of God, I escaped all those dire outcomes.  It was very unpleasant and a little scary, but all in all not much more stressful than a bad case of bronchitis.  Medications?  Mucinex and an occasional use of my Albuterol inhaler.  Took one Tyleonol each of the two nights my fever hit 102.  Other than that, I trusted my immune system and my body's built-in furnace to kill the virus. As my doctor reminded me, I'm one of the 99% who recover from this, so there's that perspective.  But I also have the perspective of a cherished church member who died in a hospital on a ventilator.  So what do I conclude from those two extremes?

None of this is to minimize the risks of this illness, nor to predict the course of the illness if you or someone else happens to get it.  And if that happens and you want to ask me any questions I'll be glad to provide even more detail.  So I urge everyone to continue to be careful, take precautions, and know that it can happen,  but it isn't an automatic death sentence.  

On 6/23/2020 at 10:10 AM, Randall said:

I think like you Bulldogtom a lot of times.  Sheesh.  Armies of programmers sitting around thinking up new silly gimmicks.  I go backpacking some just to get away from it all.  I carry my cell phone but seldom use it.  I like printed maps.  But others have all the maps on their phones.  I have those map apps too but usually can't figure them out.  You can't get away from it.  There's probably an app in Alaska to warn you when a grizzly is coming.

I’ll bet the app is named GRRaze. 

I've been telling my estimated tax filers to just file as usual (Apr 15, Jun 15, Sep 15, Jan 15), using something close to last year's figures unless there's a known reason to increase or decrease. We can make adjustments (if any) whenever the 2019 return is completed.  Not much else to do given the current situation.

Yes, it's clear that the previous tax preparer didn't understand the proper treatment of clergy taxes.  They seemed to have a rough idea of the end result, but they took an improper route to get there.  As Margaret has pointed out, they probably got fairly close to the correct final numbers.  So no harm, no foul.  

By taking the time to learn how to report clergy income and H&U allowance properly, you're doing the best job you can for your client.  You're minimizing their chances of an audit and maximizing their chances of a "no change" result in the unlikely event one occurs.  They're fortunate to have you handling their return going forward. 

I think the bookkeeper should have no role in the calculation of the H&U allowance request, especially with respect to determining the FRV.  The pastor should submit a H&U allowance request to the church based on his/her own calculations of actual vs FRV. After all, it's the minster (not the bookkeeper), who is ultimately responsible for what is reported on the tax return.  

My personal opinion & general rule is that if the minister is not pulling some portion of the H&U allowance back into taxable income, then the H&U allowance is set too low and tax savings are being left on the table. Bookkepeers often pride themselves in getting things correct to the penny, but that isn't the objective with respect to this clergy benefit. 

There are lots of suggested H&U allowance forms available online. One important point about the H&U allowance request - it should contain wording to the effect that it remains in effect until another request is submitted.  That way, if a year slips by and everyone forgets to renew it, the old amount is still in effect. 

23 minutes ago, cbslee said:

In the PPP Loan Application, the calculation of the PPP Loan Request is reduced by any EIDL advance

so in your example the $44,000 should have been the loan amount, net of the EIDL advance.

That was an assumption I had made at the outset.  But each of my clients who received a PPP reported the advance EIDL to the lender but it was not deducted from the PPP.  They each received exactly 2.5 times one week's average 2019 qualifying payroll + benefits expenses.   (one bank ADDED the advance EIDL to the  PPP amount).  Each of these banks collected the payroll info from the client, along with the advance EIDL info, and the bank calculated the PPP amount.

I told each one that their loan forgiveness would not apply to the advance EIDL, so each would end up with a repayment amount (either a lump sum or a cheap loan).  I've been quizzed about this advice, and perhaps the questions are due to clients speaking with people whose advance EIDL was deducted from the PPP. 

Is it the experience of others on this forum than the advance EIDL was deducted from the PPP before the funds were disbursed?  

It's my understanding that the amount of the PPP available for loan forgiveness is automatically reduced by the Advance EIDL

For example, an incorporated small business with 6 employees receives a $6,000 Advance EIDL through the original simplified SBA process.  They subsequently receive a $50,000 PPP through their bank.   The maximum amount subject to loan forgiveness is $44,000 (provided the percentage critera and all other loan forgiveness conditions are met). 

Is that correct?

This may not be in issue for your client, but for future reference remember that most real estate agent estimates only provide the FRV for the residence as it sits.  There needs to be an upward evaluation to allow for what would be charged to a renter with the home being fully furnished and with all utilities & maintenance expenses paid.  That can be a useful calculation in some situations. 

I've seen several references her and in other places to "choosing the 8-week period OR the 24-week period."  Just curious if anyone has a good explanation about why a PPP recipient woud elect to use the 8-week period.  I can't think of a reason other than to "just get it over with".  

4 hours ago, Christian said:

I used the method my nephew's then CPA used and never had any problems. That being said the ATX worksheet approximates the one in Pub 517. By FRV of the house do you mean the Fair Resale Value ? This is a rare bird for me so it's incumbent on me to get it correct. The CPA simply put the HA on Schedule C showing him as a minister. He showed the full amount as profit which was carried to the Schedule SE but did not allow the profit to flow to the 1040 and thus avoided income tax on it. This client gets a cash payment each year annually approved by the Board of Deacons and as noted it is shown on the W-2 she receives as a church employee in Box 14.

Margaret and Lion provided excellent additional detail on the subject. I'll just add that your nephew's then CPA you referenced was handling it incorrectly. He likely achieved the same result, so there was no negative tax consequence.  But he must have been doing some sort of override of the software (unless the return was prepared by hand...).  

You shouldn't use Schedule C to report a H&U allowance.  I don't use ATX, but I'll bet it has a worksheet for properly reporting the H&U allowance.  The worksheet should require you to calculate the lower of 1) Actual amount designated, 2) Amount actually paid, or 3) FRV of house (fully furnished & all utilities paid).   The amount designated is then taken directly to Schedule SE, and the amount taxable (if any) is added to W-2 wages & salaries with a notation of "Excess H&U Allowance). 

Drake has an excellent, intuitive worksheet for this.  I assume the ATX worksheet is similar in layout & function to the one Drake uses.  Calculating the H&U correctly is a simple process, but not necessarily easy the first time you use it.  After the first couple of run-throughs it makes perfect sense. 

6 hours ago, Lion EA said:

I hate texting. I can't write/edit/proofread on those tiny keys and tiny screen. I'd phased out my cell with clients (It was my only biz phone when I went out on my own, but quickly got a great rate for a second line in my home office) but, as you say, many younger clients want to text. Now I have my cell back on my biz cards, web site, email signature, etc. But, I'll often write them an email reply and then text them to check their email. And, the quality of the pictures of documents they send me is sometime unreadable.

I even have a couple of clients who Private Message me on FaceBook.

John: how do I save a text? I have an old iPhone 6+. I think I figured out a way when a client texted his signed 8879, but I don't try to save often and can't remember (another fun thing about aging).

If you have trouble texting, you can always set up an inexpensive bluetooth keyboard & connect to your phone to use when typing a lengthy text. But that's a little cumbersome when you're on the go.

There are probably more exotic ways to print texts, but I just take a screen shot & email it to myself.  Or just print the screenshot directly to a printer connected to the phone via wifi.  I don't feel the need to keep a written record of every text. It all depends upon the seriousness of the conversation.   

Some of my texts lately looked a lot like  like this:     ->: "Do you know when my stimulus payment's going to be here?"    A->  "I don't know.  Here's the link to IRS ........" 

Maybe your experience is different than mine, but I know for a fact I would lose some clients if I didn't text with them.  Since I'm more or less on a retirement glide path, that isn't terribly important to me, but if I had 10-20 years ahead of me before retirement that would be a concern for me.  Those millennials will eventually go somewhere else if you can't/won't communicate with them in the way they're accustomed.  

As it is, I'd probably get rid of certain of my clients if they didn't text (or at least email).  So in my case there's a bit of a reversal of priorities on this issue.  

I've run  few scenarios, and it appears that all my clients will be fine with a stretch to 12 weeks or longer, even if the 75% rule doesn't change.  (and provided they don't alter other aspects of the forgiveness requirements).  That makes sense, since the original calculation was based on 2-1/2 weeks of 2019 payroll. 

It still seems to me that everyone who received the Advance EIDL and then a PPP will wind up with the Advance-EIDL dollar amount of their PPP unforgiven, if I'm understanding the rules correctly. That isn't a complaint - just a reality.  It also makes sense if you follow the logic. But if Congress changes that, I wouldn't complain.

On 5/28/2020 at 12:42 PM, Lion EA said:

Or, the nonclient (friend, church acquaintance, relative of client, etc.) who wants your opinion because they think their tax professional gypped them out of deductions by failing to file Schedule A -- when the standard deduction was much higher than their itemized deductions or the SALT limit lowered their deductions or...

My daughter's teenage friends each received $1,200 so now my daughter's mad at me for claiming her. Please amend my return.

When will I get my stimulus check?

What will be my capital gain rate for 2020?

I often let my phone go to voice mail, because I encourage email so I have a savable trail. That meant I'd answer emails fast. Now, I'm letting many wait until I'm done for the night or until the next business morning (even if I'm sitting here on non-business days).

I agree completely with the strategy in your final paragraph.  Once your clients know your voice mail response is slowest while email and text response is fastest, most will quickly shift to email and/or text.   I always tell them I generally respond to email & text rapidly, but phone messages sometimes take a day or two.  (Often the initial response is "I've seen your message and I'll get back to you ASAP", but that seems to satisfy them as they have the comfort of knowing I'm thinking about their question. And if their question truly is time-sensitive, I can get to it appropriately)  

With a couple of exceptions, even my oldest clients have become habitual email/text communicators. Many of my older clients have developed hearing problems (as I have), so I believe this is one reason they've jumped on the email/text bandwagon.  More and more of these seniors tend to text, and these days you almost can't communicate with anyone under 45 unless you text. Since texting is fairly easy to preserve, I'm just as  fine with it as I am with email.

In any event, email/text questions tend to be more focused since they must spend a little time thinking about they're typing.  (Same goes for my reply).  Voice conversations frequently tend to be mind-dumps, useless background, or a rehash of what their brother-in-law told them about tax law.  And when the email/text we don't waste a lot of time talking about the weather, COVID, riots, grandkids, our latest doctor visit, and all the other interesting diversions we're all subject to be drawn into.  If anything, written communications can sometimes be too sparse, but that's pretty easy to rectify with a well-crafted response. 

Thanks Bart.

I think this link needs to be pinned as a resource at the top of this COVID-19 forum.

Sorry, I had a typo in my reply, but you got the point nevertheless.  I meant to say "stating they have two employees when in fact they have none"

Oh no!  Judy, I was convinced my Facebook arguments were so persuasive they were winning people over to my political opinions and religious views on a regular basis. I'm crushed.  

Do you think maybe they filled out the Advance EIDL application incorrectly, stating they have 2 shareholders when in fact they have none?

In my state WC is not a state or local tax and it isn't an employee benefit.  It is an insurance plan which simply follows special state guidelines.  Not that much different than auto insurance or General Liability insurance. So as much as I'd like to see it included in the forgiveness category, I don't see how based on the info we have now.

I did have one humorous conversation with a friend (not a client).  We were discussing an issue of his which is similar to an issue of mine.  I finally said something to this effect:

 "I'm telling you what I'm doing, but I'm not telling you that you should be doing what I'm doing.  I may suddenly change what I'm doing if I get different info from the SBA. And I can't promise I'll remember to tell you I changed what I'm doing because I may not even remember this conversation a week or more from now.  So take this conversation for what it's worth." 

He responded "I get it and I appreciate your honesty"    (I'm sure in the back of his head he was thinking "I need to keep asking John what he's doing about this.")

Great points Tom.  I just started a separate thread on the subject of a special PPP disclaimer, if you (or Lion or cbslee or anyone else) might care to comment. I'm getting concerned about the risks here.

I've become very circumspect about giving advice or opinions about PPP loan forgiveness compliance.  I even accidentally posted a rumor on another site in the midst of warning about internet advice based on rumors.    

Anyhow, I'm beginning to think it might be a good idea to come up with a special disclaimer when discussing PPP with clients.  I don't want someone's PPP loan forgiveness to fail in part or in total because they acted on something I said (or something they thought I said).

There's just too much at stake with this PPP loan forgiveness.  Does anyone here share those concerns and do you have any thoughts on what a special disclaimer may look like? 

These problems are a result of the IRS trying to comply with the impetus to push stimulus payments out as quickly as possible in order to achieve an economic goal.  They've basically turned an aircraft carrier around in the middle of a battle.  

The goal of getting the payments out is being achieved in an exceptional manner, but naturally it's messy given the conditions and time frames.  I'm not one to compliment the IRS very much, but I think under these circumstances they're doing a fantastic job.