MAMalody Posted February 5, 2008 Report Share Posted February 5, 2008 I have a problem. I must not be reading the worksheets correctly. When you look at the 1040 Clergy Worksheet, I do not see how you indicate on any of the worksheets that the pastor has an approved Form 4361 and therefore his clergy income is exempt from SE tax. I can override all the necessary figures, however, I don't like that. Plus, I need to send these worksheets to the IRS with Form 8453 and overridden figures will look like I did not fill out the forms correctly. I also don't have any confidence that the Form 8453 data entry people have a clue what happened on the tax return. I see huge problems. What have I missed on the forms? I guess I could use my own worksheets, which I have up til now, but they probably are not transmitted with the return. Jeez. Help. Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kcjenkins Posted February 5, 2008 Report Share Posted February 5, 2008 Look at the very top of the page [above the form itself'] on the SE and you will see a box to check for client who has an approved 4029 and one for 4361. Once you mark that, it will work correctly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAMalody Posted February 5, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 5, 2008 Look at the very top of the page [above the form itself'] on the SE and you will see a box to check for client who has an approved 4029 and one for 4361. Once you mark that, it will work correctly. I did that and it did not correct the problem. I will try it again. This is on 5 returns so far. Also, since you are required to send the worksheets with the F 8453, why would it not change the work sheet and NOT generate a worksheet 3 where it says the income IS subject to SE tax (or at least transferable to the SE)? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chadlonetree Posted February 6, 2008 Report Share Posted February 6, 2008 I am having the same problem. I do returns for over 300 ministers, and as you can imagine many of them are 4361 exempt. This problem is backing up my work load considerably. Every year since 2002 checking the 4361 box on top of Sch Se adjusts the SE tax to zero for ministry income. However this year it is not wokring. I can make an adjustment on Sch SE to zero it out, but then the return will not efile. All adjusted Sch SE require paper file. HELP!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chadlonetree Posted February 6, 2008 Report Share Posted February 6, 2008 I waited forever for Tech support. I sent them a return to show how it is not calculating. They said they will work on it and call me back. I will post if I hear anything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAMalody Posted February 6, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 6, 2008 I waited forever for Tech support. I sent them a return to show how it is not calculating. They said they will work on it and call me back. I will post if I hear anything. Not only post, but would you e-mail me the fix at [email protected] The only other way around this that I can see is to list it as exempt income on the SE worksheet or on the 1040 Clergy worksheet for, reduce by non SE amount. In this way you don't mess with the SE form. What do you think? Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chadlonetree Posted February 6, 2008 Report Share Posted February 6, 2008 However, you will still have to paper file. Any adjustments made manually to Sch SE will not efile. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAMalody Posted February 7, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 7, 2008 I don't know. If you use the exempt income worksheet, it is no different than if it was notary income and you can e-file those returns..or at least I have for the last 8 years or so. All ATX has to do is to add a F4361 check box on worksheet 4 of the 1040 Clergy worksheet. That checkbox would allow the clergy figures to be included in the bottom line computation therefore not being transferred to the SE. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chadlonetree Posted February 7, 2008 Report Share Posted February 7, 2008 Yeah I do not want to have to offset the SE amount by reporting notary income, but that might be my only choice until ATX gets this fixed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAMalody Posted February 7, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 7, 2008 Yeah I do not want to have to offset the SE amount by reporting notary income, but that might be my only choice until ATX gets this fixed. The exempt portion of the SE will handle items other than notary so you won't have to worry about that. Simply list what it is and the dollar amount. The big question if you go this way is what about the 1040 Clergy worksheet which will show SE income. When you send that in with the F8453 will it trip anything because it won't show up as taxable on the SE when the worksheet indicates it is taxable for SE purposes? That's why I think the worksheet fix is best. Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chadlonetree Posted February 7, 2008 Report Share Posted February 7, 2008 The exempt portion of the SE will handle items other than notary so you won't have to worry about that. Simply list what it is and the dollar amount. The big question if you go this way is what about the 1040 Clergy worksheet which will show SE income. When you send that in with the F8453 will it trip anything because it won't show up as taxable on the SE when the worksheet indicates it is taxable for SE purposes? That's why I think the worksheet fix is best. Mike "Simply List what it is and the dollar amount" When you do this, you can not efile, that is what I have been trying to say. I have no idea if it trip anything. I hate the Clergy worksheet. I want to go back in time and not have to do them (and have to send them in as well for efiles). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAMalody Posted February 8, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 8, 2008 "Simply List what it is and the dollar amount" When you do this, you can not efile, that is what I have been trying to say. I have no idea if it trip anything. I hate the Clergy worksheet. I want to go back in time and not have to do them (and have to send them in as well for efiles). I hear you. I had not tried to file one this way, I assume you did and it was rejected? Let's hope that ATX gets a fix in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chadlonetree Posted February 8, 2008 Report Share Posted February 8, 2008 I hear you. I had not tried to file one this way, I assume you did and it was rejected? Let's hope that ATX gets a fix in. Yes. When you enter anything (except where you can enter notary income) to adjust the Sch Se, when you try and create the efile it will not let you even create it (Returns with adjusments to SE income must be paper filed). Still waiting for ATX to contact me like they said they would...From 01-07 Service and Support was great for me. This restructuring has really screwed things up. I like the software, which is why I come back, but if this is how support is going to be from now on, it is time for me to move on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAMalody Posted February 8, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 8, 2008 Yes. When you enter anything (except where you can enter notary income) to adjust the Sch Se, when you try and create the efile it will not let you even create it (Returns with adjusments to SE income must be paper filed). Still waiting for ATX to contact me like they said they would...From 01-07 Service and Support was great for me. This restructuring has really screwed things up. I like the software, which is why I come back, but if this is how support is going to be from now on, it is time for me to move on. There may be another problem with the SE worksheet. I am going by memory, however, I don't remember seeing that it takes into account that you do not have to make the IRC 265 adjustment for SE purposes. Do you read the worksheet the same way I did? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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