signing an extension?

[Kea]

I filled out an extension for a client and ATX took me to a signature page -- Form 8878. It looks like a Form 8879, but it's for Forms 4868 & 2380. But when I looked through the instructions, I didn't see a signature requirement & there is no signature line on the F4868 itself.

Is this something new? I've never had any intention of filing any extensions without my client's knowledge, but trying to get signatures at the last minute is going to be an extra challenge.

Is this a new requirement?

[kcjenkins]

You don't have to get it signed now, if you look at it the first box for "I authorize ___ to enter my PIN" should be marked. You just get them to sign it when they sign the 8879. At least, that is what I do. Although the top of the page says we should be it signed, either in person or by fax or mail, first.

[imjulier]

I, Like Kea, took this to mean that the taxpayer would have to sign before I e-file the extension. While this seems reasonable, it doesn't seem practical and I will take KC's approach. I agree that its odd since the paper form does not require a signature.

Julie

[Kea]

But the "I authorize..." is just like the 8879 -- It still requires a signature. I do like KC's approach since it is more practical. If it turns out the signature is required for e-file, it may make sense to have the clients send in a paper copy. I'm sure that will make IRS happy!!! We could send the paper copies for them, but I don't plan to wait in line at the post office on the night of the 15!!

[Maribeth]

I am a CPA and in years past, when all we had were paper extensions, I signed all of my clients' extensions. I believe if you were an EA, you had the ability to do so also, but I am not sure about that.

The first time I did an electronic extension, I saw that signature requirement, and thought that does not make any sense. Actually, I really thought something quite a bit more obscene, but this is a polite board.

I do not have my clients sign anything for their extension now and I will not have them sign anything for their extensions in the future. I have their permission to put their returns on extension and I do so.

So, it ain't going to happen. Come get me IRS for another silly, stupid requirement. Come get me.

Maribeth

PS: and don't get me started on that silly, stupid 941 signature either.

[SunTaxMan]

Am I hearing that authorization to file extensions is something that should be addressed in the engagement letter?

I have never thought about including that little tidbit.

Sounds like it might be a good thing to put the authorization with the option to (1)authorize me or (2) not to authorize me without his/her/their signature.

[kcjenkins]

Well, if you think about it, the extension form does not commit anyone to anything, really, so the idea of signing a 'permission slip' to be able to file it seems silly to me. I routinely file extensions for clients that I expect to be back, but have not heard from, so that when I get those calls on the 16th, [yes, I always get some then] I can tell them 'taken care of'. A few never do come back, of course, but so what? If they already filed elsewhere, it's a non-event sort of thing. No harm, no foul. If they just forgot to call, they are covered. You do not have to sign to file it by paper, so why should we need a signature to efile the same form?

[Kea]

I agree with everything you said, KC. That's why I was surprised & bothered to see the signature requirement for the e-filed version.

[michaelmars]

except for if you are makeing a payment with the extension, then you are authorizing the govt to take money out of your clients account!

[Kea]

The extension I did today did have a balance due. Client wanted to pay by check. Since she had to mail in paper anyway, I e-mailed the extension to her so she could mail in with check.

[OldJack]

There is no signature block on a paper form 7004 extension now days. Who woulda thought it.

[JohnH]

When IRS began eliminating the signature lines on corp & personal extensions, for me it was confirmation that they are just as pleased with extensions as some of us. I had been telling clients for years that filing an extension doesn't increase your chances of an audit (it may actually decrease them slightly). Now that S-corp penalties are so severe, I file extensions on 1120S returns even if we plan to finish the return by 3/15, just as a precaution. I begin filing extensions on personal returns in mid-to-late Mar (this year I began filing them on Mar 8 due to the illness of a family member). The extension effectively takes Apr 15 off the table and it basically becomes just another day in the week.

[OldJack]

I have always tried not to file extensions and meet the deadlines. One of my fellow CPA friend says he gives a discount to clients that will let him file extensions.

[GeneInAlabama]

To ease the minds of my clients, I tell them that I ALWAYS file an extension on my own return. I really don't have time to file my own before April 15th.

[JohnH]

Good point Gene. I do the same thing - haven't filed my personal return before October in over 35 years. And I do tell clients that just like you do.

If I were not in the business and got my info to a tax preparer after mid-Mar, I'd probably pass up one who DIDN'T want to file an extension. The last thing I want is a tired, bleary-eyed tax preparer working on my info under deadline pressure. An overworked, harried person is not the one I want doing my return, even if I'm the one procrastinating by getting it to them late in the season. (I also tell client the foregoing).

[MontanaEA]

From the Form 8878 instructions:

When and How To Complete

Use this chart to determine when and how

to complete Form 8878.

IF e-filing . . .Form 4858, and the taxpayer is not authorizing an electronic funds withdrawal

THEN . . .Do not complete Form 8878

[Kea]

Thanks so much. I missed that. I admit that I didn't read the instructions. I just did a search for "signature" or "sign." I guess I should have searched for "8878."

[kcjenkins]

Thanks Montana, we all missed that. Glad to know that what I've been doing is OK. My clients never have funds withdrawn, they prefer to write a check or send a MO, and mail it in.

[Dan]

The instructions also say that the taxpayer's responsibilities (#4) is to sign and date form 8878 if taxpayer authorizes the ERO to enter or generate the taxpayer's PIN. This is in regard to e-filing form 2350. In chart, When and How to Complete. Is not this correct?

Instruction under ERO responsibilities #5: after completing items (1) through (4), give the taxpayer form 8878 for completion and review. This can be done in person or by using the U.S. mail, a private delivery service, fax, email, or an internet website.