MsTabbyKats Posted May 18, 2013 Report Share Posted May 18, 2013 We all have them...the clients you want to fire...but, for some reason...they keep coming back. I'm just looking to see how others handle this and maybe get ideas! I have 2 this year that stuck like glue. 1. After the return was done...got obnoxious to me...about "residency issue". (Which has been resolved to the way it was filed.) My plan for him: When he calls I will tell him to put it in writing...in an e-mail...his residency address and his mailing address...and that I can no longer go by the statements he gives me. 2. A woman who has multiple jobs, some of them on 1099-Misc, with inadequate withholding....and then expects me to "teach her the tax laws" so that she can understand why she owes money, but her brother-in-law, who is married with 2 kids and has one job on a W-2 and makes the same total income gets a refund. (She's a PhD in economics!!!) My plan for her: The day she contacts me I'll tell her to give me her income statements, and list her expenses. I'll do the return based on her expenses, but I will not answer any "tax theory" questions. In addition...I will remind her that for 2 years I offered to make Estimated Vouchers...so if she owes money it's because she didn't listen to my advice. If she can't agree to this...I can't do the return. Anyone else have plans to avoid the pain......... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Taxed Posted May 18, 2013 Report Share Posted May 18, 2013 I feel for you. We all have a few unreasonable or very difficult clients. 1) I don't understand what the "residency" issue is? Is it what address to put on the tax return or resident/non-resident stste issue? If it is the latter it is easy to resolve, just give them the law in your state of who is considered resident who is non resident. I would advise not getting into an hypotheticals arguement like is it fair to tak folks who do not live in your state but just get a paycheck there etc. Unreasonable people will never agree with the theory so why waste your time. 2) If she is a PhD in Eco. and she has this issue with you, there is something wrong with her head! You have offered to do estimated taxes and I would stop there. No need to again get into those theory issues because she will not appreciate it and you will be wasting your time. I have a few of those 1099-Misc recipients who always complain that they have a large balance due. So what i tell them is take 33% of what they get in 1099 income and send that in as estimated payments. If they do that (I have shown them on their return) they will either breakeven or get a refund and then they will be happy! If they don't want to do that then don't complain! And Finally you have the option to send a polite note that since you can not satisfy their tax preparation needs, give them the phone # of the nearest HRB. I have done this and you won't believe how quickly they shut up! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack from Ohio Posted May 18, 2013 Report Share Posted May 18, 2013 Significant increase in fees due to "The continued increase in major tax law changes and the necessity for training and classes to remain compliant." If she asks if the price increase is for everyone, just say yes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jainen Posted May 18, 2013 Report Share Posted May 18, 2013 >>"teach her the tax laws" so that she can understand why she owes money<< That sounds like a perfectly reasonable request to me--I wish all my clients would ask it! An economist understands the role of taxation but not the specific application of law. So now you have a tax planning engagement, in addition to the tax preparation engagement. Stuck like glue? Absolutely--and isn't your goal to have loyal clients like her, hard working professionals who rely on your expertise? You may be able to set it up as a W-4 planner or estimated payments, but you should also discuss the tax implications of 1099s. That may affect how she prices her services. and allow work-related deductions against SE tax. Professional expenses have to be allocated between Schedules A and C, so you could easily fill an hour or three just charging for what you already know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Taxed Posted May 18, 2013 Report Share Posted May 18, 2013 I have a feeling MsTabbyKats does not want to turn into a "Professor of Taxation". She won't be able to charge enough from these clients for her time and efforts! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MsTabbyKats Posted May 18, 2013 Author Report Share Posted May 18, 2013 I have a feeling MsTabbyKats does not want to turn into a "Professor of Taxation". She won't be able to charge enough from these clients for her time and efforts! Exactly! I'm not about "making more money". I'm about a stress free season...and a reasonable income. The residency issue is a NYC thing...lots of people work here who don't live here. And lots of employers don't withhold correctly. It's complicated...especially when people live with "the current girlfriend" for a month, and then move on to a new one. He's currently unemployed....I wouldn't charge him more. Just...don't insult me...and commit beforehand to "where you live". I can't just dump the PdD in economics...as I do a few of her relatives. She's not American, recently divorced and I suspect sends money home. I just gotta get her to trust that I am doing the best for her situation. I know about "raising rates". I dumped a few this year by raising rates. And "you have to pay in advance" seems to work also. One guy I told "not to come because I wouldn't let him in". I'm pretty good with the obvious and obnoxious ways to do this. I guess what I'm looking for is "how to keep someone you'd rather dump...but let them know they have to play by your rules or they will be dumped". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lion EA Posted May 18, 2013 Report Share Posted May 18, 2013 For the #1 type, if you have any worries about his real residency situation, cut him loose. A polite letter, as has been suggested, during the off season to tell him you are concentrating your business in a different direction; give him some franchise phone numbers if you want. For the #2 type, I also like the earlier suggestion of booking a tax-planning appointment at $XXX/hour with her. She probably doesn't want to know badly enough to pay and just wants to complain. But, if she's genuinely interested then tell her that now in the off-season is when you provide tax planning, and that you will NOT have the time to do so during the busy tax season. For ALL clients that are needy, I increase their fees each year, a lot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Taxed Posted May 18, 2013 Report Share Posted May 18, 2013 Exactly! I'm not about "making more money". I'm about a stress free season...and a reasonable income. The residency issue is a NYC thing...lots of people work here who don't live here. And lots of employers don't withhold correctly. It's complicated...especially when people live with "the current girlfriend" for a month, and then move on to a new one. He's currently unemployed....I wouldn't charge him more. Just...don't insult me...and commit beforehand to "where you live". I can't just dump the PdD in economics...as I do a few of her relatives. She's not American, recently divorced and I suspect sends money home. I just gotta get her to trust that I am doing the best for her situation. I know about "raising rates". I dumped a few this year by raising rates. And "you have to pay in advance" seems to work also. One guy I told "not to come because I wouldn't let him in". I'm pretty good with the obvious and obnoxious ways to do this. I guess what I'm looking for is "how to keep someone you'd rather dump...but let them know they have to play by your rules or they will be dumped". We all have to pick our fights! If you have any sympathy for this PhD woman given her family situation then as Lion suggested you may want to give it one more try. But if you find that she is unreasonable then you got to cut her loose for your own sanity! Previously I had given an example of how one of my clients paid me just $20 for a 1040X. I had to make a decision given the fact i do her entire family and her parents and brother! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slippery Pencil Posted May 19, 2013 Report Share Posted May 19, 2013 I will remind her that for 2 years I offered to make Estimated Vouchers... Stop offering and just prepare them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MsTabbyKats Posted May 19, 2013 Author Report Share Posted May 19, 2013 Stop offering and just prepare them. And, should I pay them too? No...I'm just going to "read everyone the riot act" before I start the return.....let them know my expectations and limitations. If they can't handle it...then they can find another preparer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kcjenkins Posted May 19, 2013 Report Share Posted May 19, 2013 I think you missed Slippery's point. I think he's saying that if you prepare the estimate forms, you have given them the ability to do what is needed. That is your CYA, and puts the responsibility solidly on the client. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MsTabbyKats Posted May 19, 2013 Author Report Share Posted May 19, 2013 I think you missed Slippery's point. I think he's saying that if you prepare the estimate forms, you have given them the ability to do what is needed. That is your CYA, and puts the responsibility solidly on the client. Good point! I'm going to prepare for the next 3 payments and send them to her. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TaxMan60601 Posted May 20, 2013 Report Share Posted May 20, 2013 " ... but I will not answer any "tax theory" questions." - that is my belief too - tax theory questions have always been a lost cause, I think. Because all they want is to whine a bit ... Depends on the circumstances but what I do most often is to give the clients as much as possible, clear and fast and compliant with the law, solutions of their issue (without giving them the details) so that they can make a decision on their own. But this only in case you are dealing with a human being in front of you, you know what I mean And if it is not the season now! Otherwise, all I do is to give them the right hints and the exact statements and advice so that they can reach the initially set conclusion by themselves In this case I am also for a list with expenses, or estimated payments. Otherwise, "constantly increasing fees" or "sorry buddy, but I won't be able this year" - a huge backlog or something similar is always working ... Funny, but citations of court cases is also working flawlessly so far ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FLORIDA TAX MAN Posted May 24, 2013 Report Share Posted May 24, 2013 Tell them you checked with Henry & Ricky Ticky Bloch and they say its right, so who are we to argue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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