NY CE requirement information received 10/07/2014

[easytax]

The New York State Department of Taxation and Finance (DTF) promulgated new regulations (http://www.tax.ny.gov/tp/reg/regulations.htm ) this year that require commercial tax return preparers who will prepare New York State personal income tax returns to complete continuing education requirements. You have been identified as a person who is paid to prepare these returns. The amount of required continuing education is based upon your experience.

- If the number of income tax returns you were paid to prepare is LESS THAN TEN during any of the last three years, you must complete 16 HOURS of continuing education coursework by December 31, 2015 and FOUR HOURS of coursework in 2016 and each year after that.

- If the number of income tax returns you were paid to prepare was TEN OR MORE during each of the last three years, you must complete FOUR HOURS of continuing education coursework by December 31, 2015 and each year after that.

If you intend to prepare TEN OR MORE New York State personal income tax returns during 2015, then you MUST complete continuing education coursework. If you did not prepare TEN OR MORE New York State personal income tax returns during each of the last three years, you must complete 16 HOURS of continuing education coursework by the end of December 2015, and FOUR HOURS of continuing education each year after that. If, however, you did prepare TEN OR MORE New York State personal income tax returns during each of the last three years, then you are required to complete FOUR HOURS of continuing education coursework by the end of December 2015, and FOUR HOURS of continuing education coursework each year after that.

FREE COURSEWORK

We will begin offering free training courses through live presentations by DTF personnel in locations across New York State THIS MONTH.

- The OCTOBER and NOVEMBER sessions will cover the first group of required coursework topics for the 16 HOUR course and the entire FOUR HOUR course

- Additional required coursework topics for the 16 HOUR course will be available later in 2014 and 2015

- Additional live and online versions of the coursework will be available throughout late 2014 and 2015

REGISTER NOW

Visit our Web site to learn more and follow the URL below to register for the free coursework.

http://www.tax.ny.gov/tp/reg/live-sessions-16-hours.htm (for the list of 16 HOUR coursework)

http://www.tax.ny.gov/tp/reg/live-sessions-4-hours.htm (for the list of FOUR HOUR coursework)

QUESTIONS

If you have any questions about your Continuing Education requirements or the required coursework you may call (518) 457-1929.

The Tax Department will never send you an email asking you to validate personal information such as your username, password, or account numbers.

[Jack from Ohio]

Seriously?

[MsTabbyKats]

Seriously?

Seriously.....too much or too little?

 

I signed up.

[Jack from Ohio]

Seriously.....too much or too little?

 

I signed up.

New York requires a fee to sign up if you do more than 10. At the firm we do about 5 every year. It seems that if you do less NY returns, they require more CPE. How are they going to police it? (never mind the numbers, I will have 40 hours before Dec 31 for this year alone) Seems like some people from California have taken up residence in the NY tax office.

[MsTabbyKats]

I got a different version:

 

The New York State Department of Taxation and Finance (DTF) promulgated new regulations (http://www.tax.ny.gov/tp/reg/regulations.htm) this year that require commercial tax return preparers who will prepare New York State personal income tax returns to complete continuing education requirements. You have been identified as a person who is paid to prepare these returns. The amount of required continuing education is based upon your experience.

- If the number of income tax returns you were paid to prepare is LESS THAN TEN during any of the last three years, you must complete 16 HOURS of continuing education coursework by December 31, 2015 and FOUR HOURS of coursework in 2016 and each year after that.

- If the number of income tax returns you were paid to prepare was TEN OR MORE during each of the last three years, you must complete FOUR HOURS of continuing education coursework by December 31, 2015 and each year after that.

According to our records to date, you must complete FOUR HOURS of continuing education coursework by December 31, 2015. If you don't complete the mandatory continuing education by December 31, 2015:

- You will not be authorized to prepare New York State personal income tax returns; and
- Your 2016 Tax Preparer Registration Certificate will NOT indicate that you prepare New York State personal income tax returns.

FREE COURSEWORK

We will begin offering free training courses through live presentations by DTF personnel in locations across New York State THIS MONTH.

- The OCTOBER and NOVEMBER sessions will cover the FOUR HOURS of required coursework

- Additional live and online versions of the coursework will be available throughout late 2014 and 2015
REGISTER NOW

Visit our Web site to learn more and follow the URL below to register for the free coursework.
http://www.tax.ny.gov/tp/reg/live-sessions-4-hours.htm (for the list of FOUR HOUR coursework)

QUESTIONS

If you have any questions about your Continuing Education requirements or the required coursework you may call (518) 457-1929.

The Tax Department will never send you an email asking you to validate personal information such as your username, password, or account numbers.

PLEASE DO NOT REPLY to this email. Replies are routed to an unmonitored mailbox, so we don't read them or respond.

 

 

I have no idea how they will police non-NYers!

[Jack from Ohio]

I am getting the feeling that the "...continuing education credits..." must be courses that NY has approved. I would guess that all the CPE that E.A.'s and CPA's have to take is irrelevant? I will continue with my training and seminars just as in the past and will wait for the letter from NY saying we have not complied. There may be 5 clients available for a NY preparer by tax year 2015 filing.

If NY will not accept CPE approved by the IRS, then I feel that we have no need to do NY tax returns. Glad I live in the Midwest and not on the liberal infected coastal areas of our country!!

Rant over.

[easytax]

New York requires a fee to sign up if you do more than 10. At the firm we do about 5 every year. It seems that if you do less NY returns, they require more CPE. How are they going to police it? (never mind the numbers, I will have 40 hours before Dec 31 for this year alone) Seems like some people from California have taken up residence in the NY tax office.

 

 

I got a different version:

According to our records to date, you must complete FOUR HOURS of continuing education coursework by December 31, 2015. If you don't complete the mandatory continuing education by December 31, 2015:

- You will not be authorized to prepare New York State personal income tax returns; and

- Your 2016 Tax Preparer Registration Certificate will NOT indicate that you prepare New York State personal income tax returns.

If you have any questions about your Continuing Education requirements or the required coursework you may call (518) 457-1929.

I have no idea how they will police non-NYers!

 

Jack,

 

Just off phone with NY --- IRS CE's do not count --- they have no way (currently) to do receptacle (working on it but not anticipated soon). The NY "open registration" will open in late November 2014 so you can file in 2015.  The CE requirements DO NOT apply for 2014 filings done in 2015 --- they will only be applicable for the 2016 filing year (2015 actual year). That is why NY is giving us to December 31, 2015 to do all the CE's.

 

Ms TabbyKats,

 

Yes, my notice did not require ANY CE's but stated I could take the 16 and 4 CE's and have it "noted" on my registration certificate. I only do 1-2 and have not filed any in 2014 (2013 tax year). You apparently signed up for the "live" courses at a NY location.  I will utilize the online courses which should be available by November (I am cheap and travel little, etc. - part hermit).

 

As far as "policing" the returns -- they will simply send fines to the preparer and "clients" using that preparer -- if the preparer has not registered and met their requirements. POSSIBLY the preparers might "not pay attention" to the fines, etc. but when the preparers "client" gets involvement --- then NY has leverage...

 

So far --- CA, NY and I have heard MD have preparer requirements.  Any others out there (strangely enough - while closer to MD than NY (south central PA) and with a number of "mail-in's", I did not know about MD.

 

All the fun we have to look forward too ---- I just LOVE -- government changes and increased user costs -- don't you?  /S

[MsTabbyKats]

Where have I been?????   I just read the CA requirements...!!!!

 

https://www.ftb.ca.gov/professionals/registered_tax_preparers.shtml

 

Can someone give me a link to a discussion here?

 

It looks like I will be adding CA to my never ending list of returns I won't do (and I do many).  I have to count from last year.....

[MsTabbyKats]

And Maryland!

 

http://www.dllr.state.md.us/license/taxprep/taxpreplic.shtml

[ADGFINANCIAL]

I'm a NY preparer. In NY the NATP is offering the courses. I'm signed up for this year. They are on the NYS site.

I guess it's just going to be a fact of life going forward. I'm sure there will be a online program for next year.

[Lion EA]

Are EAs still exempt from the NY's definition of commercial preparers?  I have lots of commuters.

 

And, CA?  I know if you're in-state.  But, I have about one per year PY CA and PY CT or NY.

 

There's another western state that has preparer registration, Oregon?  Utah?

[MsTabbyKats]

A bit off topic...but:

I think I just retired!

DH sold his business last April...and I was planning on dropping lots of clients so I could keep him company (PITAs, EITC, PITAs, high income. PITAs, over 5 state multi states, PITAs)...and I think this just is the final straw.

[Lee B]

In Oregon the only exempt preparers are CPAs and Tax Attorneys.

 

Enrolled Agents has been having an ongoing fight with the Oregon Board of Tax Preparers for some years

 

as the Tax Board is almost to the point of not acknowledging EAs.

[MsTabbyKats]

I just called CA...and asked if I am a NY preparer do I have to "do that stuff"...and she said "No...just do what your state requires".

[jklcpa]

Are EAs still exempt from the NY's definition of commercial preparers?  I have lots of commuters.

 

And, CA?  I know if you're in-state.  But, I have about one per year PY CA and PY CT or NY.

 

There's another western state that has preparer registration, Oregon?  Utah?

 

 

I would check into this to see if NY will continue to use the definitions going forward that they used for the 2013 year.  Jack from Ohio, this might help you too, since NY has different definitions for "tax preparer" and "commercial tax preparer". CPAs, EAs, attorneys licensed to pratice law, employees under direct supervision in firms of those CPAs, EAs, attorneys aren't considered tax preparers under the 2013 definition. This is from the NY website:

http://www.tax.ny.gov/tp/reg/tpregmore.htm

 

It seems that the EAs need to check to see if the definition has changed.

[MAMalody]

If I recall correctly CA requires for non CPAs, EAs, Attorney's that they are registered with CTEC, which has CPE requirements.  Out of state preparers have no requirements on them.

[Lynn EA USTCP in Louisiana]

Courtesy of the NAEA Forum:

 

thanks to the efforts of NYSSEA and David Silverman, EA, enrolled agents are exempt from all of this.

[SaraEA]

The states have always been the testing grounds for eventual federal policies.  Back when we had "little" government, free public schooling was started in MA and eventually became a national policy.  MA also initiated mandatory health insurance, and their program was successful enough to model the ACA along the same lines.  The same route was almost followed regarding licensing/regulation of paid tax preparers.  CA and OR have run successful programs for some time, so the government tried to adapt those models nationwide.  They went about it the wrong way, however, and were stopped.  What we're seeing now is the states scrambling to regulate tax prep because the feds aren't doing it, and state tax coffers suffer just as much as the federal treasury from the actions of stupid or dishonest tax pros.

 

I'm glad NY is finally taking steps to assure that tax preparers know what they're doing.  Up until now it was just a money grabber--tax pros had to pay for the privilege of doing NY returns.  In my office those of us who are exempt from registration (EAs and CPAs) sign all the NY returns and don't feel a bit guilty.  We give them accurate, honest returns and they want to take our money too?

 

I can't imagine why NY won't recognize IRS approved training though.  Maybe because they don't know the ins and outs of how to do so?  I can see why they would want so many hours of state specific CEs, like CA does, so maybe all those hours they are requiring are all about NY tax?  Interestingly, when state speakers present at seminars that hour or two does not count for EAs but does for CPAs (who are state licensed).  I often go to 8 hour seminars but only get 6 CEs (not that I don't learn something in the other 2, they just don't count).  I guess NY is just doing the same thing in reverse.

 

When this kind of madness happens it usually triggers a national policy.  It will eventually have to happen with same sex marriages and state sales taxes because now every state is doing something different and it gets too confusing when you cross state lines.  So just maybe national registration of paid tax pros will come to be, if only because having 50 different sets of rules doesn't work.

[Jack from Ohio]

The states have always been the testing grounds for eventual federal policies.  Back when we had "little" government, free public schooling was started in MA and eventually became a national policy.  MA also initiated mandatory health insurance, and their program was successful enough to model the ACA along the same lines.  The same route was almost followed regarding licensing/regulation of paid tax preparers.  CA and OR have run successful programs for some time, so the government tried to adapt those models nationwide.  They went about it the wrong way, however, and were stopped.  What we're seeing now is the states scrambling to regulate tax prep because the feds aren't doing it, and state tax coffers suffer just as much as the federal treasury from the actions of stupid or dishonest tax pros.

 

I'm glad NY is finally taking steps to assure that tax preparers know what they're doing.  Up until now it was just a money grabber--tax pros had to pay for the privilege of doing NY returns.  In my office those of us who are exempt from registration (EAs and CPAs) sign all the NY returns and don't feel a bit guilty.  We give them accurate, honest returns and they want to take our money too?

 

I can't imagine why NY won't recognize IRS approved training though.  Maybe because they don't know the ins and outs of how to do so?  I can see why they would want so many hours of state specific CEs, like CA does, so maybe all those hours they are requiring are all about NY tax?  Interestingly, when state speakers present at seminars that hour or two does not count for EAs but does for CPAs (who are state licensed).  I often go to 8 hour seminars but only get 6 CEs (not that I don't learn something in the other 2, they just don't count).  I guess NY is just doing the same thing in reverse.

 

When this kind of madness happens it usually triggers a national policy.  It will eventually have to happen with same sex marriages and state sales taxes because now every state is doing something different and it gets too confusing when you cross state lines.  So just maybe national registration of paid tax pros will come to be, if only because having 50 different sets of rules doesn't work.

Sounds political.....

[Uncle Sam]

For those of you who are concerned regarding NY's rules, and if you are an EA or CPA (or both), why not join NYSSEA and you'll continually be informed as to what's happening in New York regarding the tax profession?

 

NYSSEA is continually making efforts to make itself known to tax legislators, regulators, and the Department of Taxation & FInance in making them each aware of the effects of any tax legislation or regulation or policy in tax administration and how it impacts the practitioner community.

[Jack from Ohio]

For those of you who are concerned regarding NY's rules, and if you are an EA or CPA (or both), why not join NYSSEA and you'll continually be informed as to what's happening

in New York regarding the tax profession?

NYSSEA is continually making efforts to make itself known to tax legislators, regulators, and the Department of Taxation & FInance in making them each aware of the effects of

any tax legislation or regulation or policy in tax administration and how it impacts the practitioner community.

Not worth the expense for 5 returns.

[Lion EA]

I appreciate what NYSSEA did (and does) for EAs.  In fact, I sent money to their legal committee or whatever was asking for monetary help when NY registration first appeared and EAs had to comply that first year.  My favorite group for education is the NY/CT-ATP.  Our two-day December Seminar will include NY and CT updates as well as federal tax courses (yeah, 16 hours of CE for CPAs but only 14 for EAs).  http://nyctatp.org/