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Catherine, Thanks for the information, You have gone out of your way to answer all questions and criticisms. Anti's wont be happy till only criminals can carry guns. Phil

I will NOT use a cloud based tax prep software except for a backup option (pay per return) because I don't have any good options. My main objection are as follows: 1) They control your client files. It is on their servers NOT your hard drive and should you choose to leave them and want access to all your client files you will have to pay a kings ransom in order to convert the data. That is TOTALLY UNACCEPTABLE to me. It is my clients and my data. I should NOt have to pay for my own property. 2) With cloud based software you will need internet access 100% of the time to use that software. In my work environment that is not always possible. Unfortunately the future looks bleak for desktop based tax software. Most companies will offer cloud based solutions and once the tipping point is reached it will most likely end support or enhancement of desktop based software, or make it economically unfeasable. I can see the writing on the wall! If that day comes I may have to think about another line of work!

I do not have the time to respond to every one of your claims here, except to say individual circumstances vary and the vast majority of civilian-owned firearms that "make an appearance" in self-defense SAVE many, many lives every year -- and those are almost never reported (certainly not nationally; sometimes locally). I will address your assertion above, though. You have stated what can be termed the "Quaker fallacy" -- that if you save your own life by killing another, that makes YOU a bad person. WRONG. Utterly. You did not invade another's house, looking to steal, attack, or kill. Most of those who are "just" burglars will flee INSTANTLY when faced with a homeowner with a gun. Those who do not would not stop until one of you was dead, regardless. It is your right and your -duty- to protect your own life against one who will kill you. The injunction is not "do not kill" but rather "do not murder." Please listen to Rabbi Daniel Lapin's most-excellent CD on the Ten Commandments where he makes this point and distinction far better than I could. To save your own life is to protect a gift given to you by your Creator, against one who has no right to take it from you. You would only become a bad person if you left your house, malice aforethought, with the intent to hunt someone down to maim or kill. To refuse to defend self (as some Quakers espouse) frees those evil-doers to wreak havoc at will, knowing that none will stop them. It is tantamount to proclaiming that evil may propagate unchecked through the land. “Silence in the face of evil is itself evil: God will not hold us guiltless. Not to speak is to speak. Not to act is to act.” ― Dietrich Bonhoeffer I will add "inaction" to Rev. Bonhoeffer's quote. Now, a couple other minor bits: I did not intend to judge parents harshly. The intent was to show there are other ways to handle the presence of firearms in the house. That which is hidden, not discussed, but NOT locked up is a serious temptation to children. If a family wishes to not speak about their firearms with the kids, they need to keep them locked where the kids cannot get at them. When one is not home, firearms need to be securely locked. No one breaking into this house could put their hands on ANY of our guns, no matter how long they were in here. The fire you mentioned in a later post? No firearms and no ammunition would be responsible for explosions. Cartridges do NOT "shoot" unless they are in a barrel. Over-cooked the powder could burn, yes, and they'd be ruined and might cause small damage in the immediate vicinity. FAR less damage than you can cause with a soda bottle, vinegar, and baking soda. Large quantities of powder (if they were reloaders) could make a nasty hot spot in a fire, but powder BURNS, it does not explode. For explosions, look at the fireworks -- those are designed to have small explosions and propel the sparkly bits. Again I will say: the genie cannot be put back in the bottle. Firearms exist. The bad guys will ALWAYS be able to get their hands on them. We can either let the bad guys have ALL of them, or we can stop interfering with the good guys trying to own them legally. And the purpose of the Second Amendment is to insure that the government NEVER stops the citizenry from owning firearms, as that is OUR last defense against tyranny in government. I'm done on this topic -- there are plenty of articles and info available online, including my web site at www.constitutiondecoded.com.

All of the above plus I'm out in the boonies so lose internet access even more often than I lose electricity, and for over a week at a time. Currently, I take my external hard drive off my desktop and take my laptop and drive to the library or a school comfort station where I can have power and get some work done. I wouldn't want to access the internet over such a public system, though. Want to be working from my hard drive in a public environment.

Your comments are why you should have membership in the NRA. I joined this year!

I only want to add one other thing to Catherine's excellent response. To not protect ourself is our own business, but to fail to protect someone else that we could protect is inexcuseable. I wouldn't want that hanging over my head.

They can't even create software that accurately keeps, records or transmits data that is accurate complete and secure on computers in tax preparer's office. What planet do you think I just landed here from to think that I will trust them with ANYTHING in their cloud based servers? I was born on Friday, but not last Friday! But, I will NOT put tax client information on ANY cloud based software.

Great response, Cat. That comment from Lion about becoming a killer really bothered me, too. Your answer was much better than mine would have been. She's a nice person, I hope she takes your words to heart. No peaceful person, doing nothing wrong, should feel guilty for simply defending themselves or others against a violent attacker. I have never heard it expressed better than " To save your own life is to protect a gift given to you by your Creator, against one who has no right to take it from you." I especially liked your summation. "Again I will say: the genie cannot be put back in the bottle. Firearms exist. The bad guys will ALWAYS be able to get their hands on them. We can either let the bad guys have ALL of them, or we can stop interfering with the good guys trying to own them legally. And the purpose of the Second Amendment is to insure that the government NEVER stops the citizenry from owning firearms, as that is OUR last defense against tyranny in government. "

I smell total mess coming: So, taxpayer goes to IRS site on January 15th and files. Big refund and EITC. Then, the other information is filed with the IRS for the job they forgot about, and the stock options they excercised. Taxpayer gets a huge bill that they can't pay, and the IRS has to be both the "paid preparer" and the prosecutor for the taxpayer. Will the IRS be subject to penalties for not asking all the questions and obtaining the documentation for EIC? Should they have known or did they ask the taxpayer all the relevent questions? Wouldn't they be subject to gross negligence penalties? Go government. Get me some more business. Tom Hollister, CA

Seems to me the IRS is going to have it's hands full over the next couple years trying/failing to deal with another boondoggle called the Affordable Care Act (I never knew that health care and taxes were so naturally inter-related). Frankly, I'd be okay if Congress put me out of biz by adopting the Fair Tax. It would be worth it to simplify my life and those of everyone I know and to put the IRS out of business (other than monitoring health care, of course ).

Like August 30?

When I was shopping, I realized that the less expensive software lacked features I needed for my clientele and for the way I work. I then re-demo'ed the high end products: ProSystem fx, Ultra Tax, and Lacerte. Lacerte worked less well for me; I think their support was less responsive, also. I settled on Pro fx as the best and with the best support, and then negotiated a price I could live with. The jump in price from ProSeries, for instance, to Pro fx was less than four extra typical returns for me (and from ATX to Pro fx, less than eight). And, the extra speed I gained in importing K-1s, G/L, Kiddy Tax, multi-states, no wait for support, and on and on, gave me plenty of time to prepare many more than four or eight or ten extra returns and have even better profit than I would've had with a lower end software. Now is the time to demo everything out there. We all work and think differently, so what matters most is if the software has the features you want, works the way you do. You're the one to prioritize. (I'm a sole proprietor, so support was very important to me, probably number one on my list or at least a close second behind reliability, but that's tied to support; but it would be less important for a younger more technically oriented person or a firm with a techie on staff.) List your priorities, demo all the software you think might work for you, and THEN negotiate the best price. If price knocks your #1 out, then you already know your #2 and what you're willing to give up to get the price you need. Demo-ing isn't a waste of time. It'll set you up for years of better workflow and profits. And, you can polish off your extensions at the same time.

Why haven't the schools banned pens and pencils? Those could be used as weapons and so could the eating utensils from the cafeteria. What about the baseball and softball bats, tennis rackets, hockey and lacrosse sticks. More weapons! Wire or gut from the stringed instruments all should go too! No more sports or music because of the danger.

One can accomplish something similar by leaving the "home" computer on, and using off the shelf (free) remote access software. Prevents the data from residing on some unknown server(s) you have no control over, which in itself, may violate privacy laws in your state.

And this information is a surprise to whom?

Actually, Prosystem FX would cost my firm $20K and that included a 35% discount. To recoup the additional costs properly, prep costs will have to increase an average of $15-20 per client just to break even with all costs involved. The majority of our returns are in the range of $110-$200 and clients will NOT understand an increase of 15-20% in one year. The savings in time, will be offset by the learning curve, extra scrutiny from conversion and other logistical costs. $5k additional cost could be assimilated much easier, but the total benefits of the new program would, at best, wash out with the additional time and logistical costs of changing.

Please do not put words in my mouth, or ASSUME that you know my opinion, even when you admit it is " your undeclared point of view from your biased right wing" POV. I have NEVER suggested that the IRS should not go after cheaters. In fact, I have often griped about them not going after cheaters that their own software should make easy to find. Today, there is a good article in Accounting Today, about that very thing. This is from the Treasury Inspector General for Tax Administration, not generally called a "biased right wing web site". IRS Not in Compliance with Improper Payments Law The Internal Revenue Service was not in compliance with all requirements of a 2010 law that increased agency accountability for reducing improper payments in federal programs, according to a new report that cited the high rate of improper payments for the Earned Income Tax Credit. The report, released publicly Monday by the Treasury Inspector General for Tax Administration, found that the only program the IRS has identified for improper-payment reporting is the Earned Income Tax Credit Program. The IRS estimates that 21 to 25 percent of EITC payments were issued improperly in fiscal year 2012. The dollar value of these improper payments was estimated to be between $11.6 billion and $13.6 billion. However, TIGTA auditors found that the IRS has not established annual improper payment reduction targets for the EITC and has not reported an improper payment rate of less than 10 percent. This is the second consecutive year that the IRS has not been in compliance with IPERA. The Improper Payments Elimination and Recovery Act of 2010, also known as IPERA, increased agency accountability for reducing improper payments in federal programs and required agencies to identify programs that are at high risk for improper payments. Agencies are also required to set annual improper payment reduction targets for high risk programs. TIGTA initiated its audit because IPERA requires TIGTA to assess the IRS’s compliance with improper payment requirements. The objective of its review was to assess the IRS’s compliance with IPERA. The Treasury Department identifies the programs for which the IRS must assess the risk of improper payments. The IRS compiles the required information and forwards it to the Treasury for inclusion in the department’s agency financial report. TIGTA's analysis of the information provided by the IRS to the Treasury indicated that the IRS is not in compliance with all IPERA requirements. “Although the IRS has implemented a number of programs over the years to address Earned Income Tax Credit improper payments, our auditors have found that the IRS faces significant challenges to becoming compliant with the Improper Payments Elimination and Recovery Act,” said TIGTA Inspector General J. Russell George in a statement. Specifically, the process the Department uses to assess the risk of improper payments within its bureaus does not effectively assess the risk of improper payments in tax administration, TIGTA found. In addition, the ever-changing population of EITC claimants makes it difficult for the IRS to gain lasting improvements in EITC compliance through outreach, education and enforcement. TIGTA made no recommendations in this report. However, prior reports contained five specific recommendations for improvement to which the IRS agreed. The prior reports evaluated the IRS’s compliance with improper payment requirements contained in Executive Order 13520 and the adequacy of the IRS’s fiscal year 2011 assessment of the risk of improper payments. In response to the report, IRS CFO Pamela J. LaRue pointed out that the report had stated, “ased on materiality, it is reasonable to omit [Earned Income Tax Credit] underpayments when computing the Fiscal Year 2012 improper payment rate. However, the IRS should continue to evaluate the significance of EITC underpayments annually and ensure that underpayments are included in its annual estimate of the EITC improper payment rate if warranted.” “The IRS will continue to evaluate the significance of underpayments and report on that in the Fiscal Year 2013 estimate,” she said.

I hope every Drake user will encourage Drake to try to get a special 'bundle' price for their customers from SuperForms or some other good forms package. That was ATX's strong point, having such a fantastic number of forms. Drake should be big enough to negotiate a discount price for their users.

I saw it coming when they dropped the ATX forum before the end of the tax season several years ago. That convinced me to drop ATX. For years, it had been the best software available and had excellent customer support.

Lion: You seem to have the type of practice that can support the high end priced packages, like Pro System FX and I would expect Jack's office does as well. He and his firm should most certainly consider the high end tax software, as you have done. I wish I was in the position to be able to do the same, use one of the more sophisticated programs and find that it was cost effective for a practice like mine. For many of us though, ATX was a unique product that let us get high end features through its extreme ability to be customized, while at very affordable for the small office. ATX also had something I don't think even ProSystem FX has; Tons and Tons of forms that are only available in packages like SuperForms. For me, as an Attorney, I used the other forms in ATX almost more than the tax preparation forms. For instance, I have incorporated clients all across the country and the forms in ATX made that much easier and faster than downloading forms from the various States. Through ATX's flexible structure prior to 2012, I created my own forms, and documents to include: Corporate Books, Stock Certificates, 2553's, State registration forms, etc all in custom templates that I could auto-fill in literally minutes; letting ATX do the work, so I could use my time to provide my clients the legal expertise they needed. No other software had this ability, NONE! And now ATX does not have this ability either. Also, my primary business is practice before the IRS and the U.S. Tax Court, something the extra forms in ATX supported extremely well. Now that I have left ATX, I will almost certainly need to buy a forms product to supplement the tax preparation software. And nothing will quite meet the flexibility and sophistication ATX had prior to 2012.

FTS13 you need to also fire this client! Don't be surprised if he tries to hang this around your neck! Hang on to the tax return copy and also the authorization signatures.

What I heard (though not mentioned in the article KC posted) is that the IRS will populate the start of a return but the taxpayer can add certain basic things like itemized deductions, small biz (Cez?) and a few other things. I still think they're going to have their hands full for years to come with the whole health care debacle. They're already saying they're short-handed. Even if they farm out writing the software they're still going to need a small army (gov't mentality) to service something like this. It generates little (if any) new revenue. I just don't see it happening, at least not anytime soon (which probably means they're voting to approve it even as I type this!). Even if this turns into reality I don't see it impacting most of us. I don't get a lot a 1040EZ's anyway--just a handful where the client demands I prep for their kid (even though I tell them they can pop it out for free in 10 minutes). My guess is that's pretty typical of the preparers on this site (might take a bite out of some of the big box outfits that seem to advertise for this kind of client).

Depending on whether he ever wants to be around his roommate again, I'd call the bank, IL, IRS Identity Theft division, and the local police. Maybe small claims court after filing a police report. Change locks. Get a new roommate. After bank returns funds, ask them to open a new account free of charge and close the old account. Depending on relative sizes, and after the police report, a punch in the nose or slap in the face!

I don't have to program my own software, reinvent the wheel, write macros. I can configure my program any way I want by checking a box for all returns or just this return (and, if I had other preparers, by preparer or by office or by other groups I designate or by types of return or combinations of those or...). It knows my PIN and my company info. I can have template returns (but I don't have a typical return, so don't; besides most are continuing clients and roll over with the forms I typically need). It can answer questions, assign e-file PINs, whatever I want it to do. The programmers have done the heavy lifting, so all I have to do is check or uncheck a box, answer yes or no. When I install a new year, I'm ready to work on returns, not work on the program! And, yes, I pay for that privilege, but my expertise is in tax preparation. My clients don't pay me for programming.

Terry, I didn't think you were, but over the years, each time a preparer here picks up a new client that was prepared in a prior year by a CPA, if a mistake is made, there has been some bashing like we CPAs think we are better than EAs and RTRPs. I don't think like that. I like to think I received a good education and took a test that proved my competency in a variety of areas. I do my best to keep up with the ever changing tax laws and to pick CPE that will keep me up to date and will benefit the clients in my practice. Believe me, I am human and I make my share of mistakes. I know from hindsight that I've had clients lie to me only to find out later. Those that I find out about I tell them to amend, but I can't force them to file it. Those clients that lie are asked to move on. I try my best to produce excellent work at a reasonable price. There are many people on this forum that are not CPAs that I hold in high regard and I know are much more knowledgeable than I am. Sorry that's a little rambling and disjointed. One thing that really frosts me is when I sit in a group-live CPE seminar with my peers only to see them working through a self-study course, working on their laptop, repeatedly answering text messages, reading for pleasure, or disappearing completely (yes, a few years ago one young person bragged about the golf he'd just played and made it back for the mid-afternoon head count!). I pay for those courses and really want to maximize the learning, but then there are these others.... Totally frustrating to me. The staff of the state society of CPAs now stays in attendance to "babysit" the group so some of this is being curtailed. Sorry for the rant. It's a pet peeve of mine.