Why did ATX go to this new format? Why now?

[SCL]

i thought so...LOL!

your self righteous offense at a vulgar response depends on your own self interest.

[kcjenkins]

PLEASE, SCL, DO NOT USE A "VULGAR RESPONSE" ON THIS BOARD.

[Jack from Ohio]

i thought so...LOL!

your self righteous offense at a vulgar response depends on your own self interest.

Please offer a method to switch software while the office has 8-10 people working each day with a full client load. When is the time for learning the new software with a full schedule? How much productive time will be lost in the learning curve since no one in the office has any experience with any other software? When is the right time to "switch over" to the new software? How much extra time is involved in making sure all details on the return "convert" accurately? I am hearing 7-10 days for conversion. ATX may have their issues solved before that and "switching over" can't occur until the converted data is available.

These are all issues at the firm with 3,000 clients and 10 staff members.

In my private practice, stand alone WIN7 64 bit machine, I only experience the occasional (no pattern) program shut down and the print program that prints thing I tell it not to. Other than that, the program is working fine and smooth. I am upgrading my system from 4GB RAM to 8GB (system max) for a little more speed.

Any reasonable suggestions of a way to switch software in the middle of an already delayed season wiil be considered and appreciated.

[Gail in Virginia]

Jack, I can't help with most of the issues, but on your stand alone system with the issues of printing things you tell it not to, I have a suggestion. I saw this in another thread either here or on the official board and so far it is working for me. Instead of just unchecking the box to tell it not to print (what a reasonable person would expect to work), uncheck the box. Then check the box telling it to print, then uncheck it again. Now print. Sounds silly, but I have not printed extra copies since I started doing it that way.

[ReadingEA]

I switched over Monday to ProSeries. It's not like a swtich that you just throw though and stop using ATX all together. I have some preparers (I have 5) who are still trying to struggle along with ATX until the conversion data comes back from ProSeries so that we can do rollovers (they call them "transfers" with Proseries). We do about half of our total volume with the client in front of us and the other half as drop offs. For the more complicated returns, some of my preparers are using ATX; they just start the rollover and opening process 20 minutes before the client is expected and pray for the best. It takes them the full hour usually to complete the return (last year is took maybe 45 mins tops). So we are in a "hybrid" phase I suppose but it sure beats waiting for ATX's next miracle fix. I had to give my preparers some hope! I personally, and 1 other preparer have been using ProSeries exculisively since we got it. Yes, I was scared! But that was Monday and I can honestly say that by today (Thursday) I can fly through a return atleast as quickly as last years ATX version. I really enjoy some of the features especially not having to recreate the e-file after every click of the mouse! It's funny how we are scared of change - I've been with ATX since Saber 2002 and dreaded having to retrain and relearn a new system but finally made the plunge out of necessity and am glad I did. I just had to remind myself that its me who prepares the taxes not my software. The software is simply a tool - I'm the expert.

[Jack from Ohio]

Jack, I can't help with most of the issues, but on your stand alone system with the issues of printing things you tell it not to, I have a suggestion. I saw this in another thread either here or on the official board and so far it is working for me. Instead of just unchecking the box to tell it not to print (what a reasonable person would expect to work), uncheck the box. Then check the box telling it to print, then uncheck it again. Now print. Sounds silly, but I have not printed extra copies since I started doing it that way.

Tried that. Clicked to choose all, clicked again to unselect all. Then checked 1 page (8879) it printed 20.

[JohnH]

---> Any reasonable suggestions of a way to switch software in the middle of an already delayed season wiil be considered and appreciated <----

Been there, done that - in a manufacturing environment. I acknowledge that ours is a service industry, but the principles are exactly the same. It's never good business practice to be hostage to a single vendor. As a matter of fact, it is flirting with business suicide.

With a volume of 3,000 returns and 8-10 employees, I'd have long ago been using two software vendors. I'd have 6-8 people using the primary vendor, and my best 2-3 employees using the secondary vendor. Personally, I'd be familiar with both programs. Then, if my primary vendor failed me or put me in the hole for any reason, my backup plan would be in place and my 2-3 best employees could be mobilized to quickly bring everyone else up to speed. I'd have already taken the time to know enough about both vendors to be able to train, and more importantly to evaluate the quality of the training provided by others.

If I found myself in that situation without already having the plan in place, I'd immediately devote whatever resources were necessary to implement it. And I'd do that no matter how well my current vendor's product might be working for me at the moment, no matter how good a relationship I might currently have with my current vendor, and no matter how confident I might be about my current vendor's future.

I'd do all of that before I prepared my next tax return.

[RitaB]

I am holding out for 12.7 or probably Saturday, whichever comes first. At my firm (me), the ratio of returns to preparer is 393 to 1. I have been able to do 29% of the volume I did last year at this time. At this rate, if 71% of my clients agree to get extensions, and if I can continue working these hours, I will finish up 2012 on or about New Year's Eve.

I think I can learn new software, and even enter all these mile-long depreciation schedules from scratch by 4th of July, tops.

I think others are just a little slower than last year, and yes, I would stay the course if that were the case. I just don't have time for this. I was putting out hay at 9:30 last night, and my cows are volunteering to come clean the office and answer the phone. I am also the janitor and secretary here. They can't push the buttons to put people on hold, and they spill a lot of stuff.

[Lion EA]

When I went out on my own full force years ago, I converted from ATX to ProSystem fx. Profx's conversion program was included on the CD or downloaded program for the prior year. I converted my few returns so had them in both ATX and Profx for the prior year. The conversion took minutes. Then I pro forma'd (rolled over) from prior year Profx to the then current year as client dropped off. The learning curve was very short, and both tax support and tech support were very supportive. Don't assume you'll be frozen for a week. Call a couple of companies you're interested in to ask about their conversion process.

Depending on your size and the skill level of your people and your own comfort with training others, you might want a company that will come to your site to train. Or a live webinar that you can all do together. Or individual training videos. You might want each of your staff to be able to call support. Maybe you want live chat, email, or other support options as well as a knowledgebase and telephone support (I can call but opt to leave a message if I can't hold right then; I remain in the queue and they call me back when it's my turn, or I specify a time for them to call me back). Ask your prospective companies what they offer and find one to fit your needs as a primary or secondary software vendor.

[jklcpa]

Jack in Ohio, I like JohnH's suggestion about having 2 programs. If you or the other partners aren't keen on doing this at the firm this year, you could purchase the second software on a pay-per-return basis with minimal cash outlay for those returns that you prepare outside the firm to test it out yourself and also to become familiar with it. You could also limp through this season with ATX and test out new programs in the summer when the workload is somewhat less. Some vendors will give the prior year program as a free trial. You could take a few of the most basic returns you do and recreate them on the new software. You'd have the original return to compare results, look of the product, and the time to prepare them in each program.

Any software you try will be a learning experience, but remember that we are going through that each year with ATX too. Yes, most of the program is similar in appearance to prior years, but each year there have been changes that we have to learn along with the workarounds that are necessary or the shortcuts that make us faster. I think you will find that after preparing just a few returns with new software that you will be more comfortable with it. You might even find some features that are helpful to you that ATX doesn't provide.

[Numbers]

Folks, ATX took it on the chin this year. I think next year this will be a long forgotten nightmare and you guys will love it once again!!!

Wrong answer... CCH has done this kind of thing over and over again. They fundamentally do not support their software to an adequate degree.

P - finished over 300 returns since Saturday morning... which is when I installed DRAKE

[Numbers]

Nearly 3,000 clients, 10 preparers and have been using ATX since 2002. Any suggestions about how to change software?

The Drake conversion is good, couple small glitches that tech support fixed really fast for me.

Took about 3 days to get my staff up to speed. My staff is really, really good, mostly all EA's and/or CPA's. Might make a difference, I am not sure what your staff looks like, but if they are knowledgeable professionals they should transition as easily as mine did. It took days, not weeks to transition.

[Numbers]

Please offer a method to switch software while the office has 8-10 people working each day with a full client load. When is the time for learning the new software with a full schedule? How much productive time will be lost in the learning curve since no one in the office has any experience with any other software? When is the right time to "switch over" to the new software? How much extra time is involved in making sure all details on the return "convert" accurately? I am hearing 7-10 days for conversion. ATX may have their issues solved before that and "switching over" can't occur until the converted data is available.

These are all issues at the firm with 3,000 clients and 10 staff members.

In my private practice, stand alone WIN7 64 bit machine, I only experience the occasional (no pattern) program shut down and the print program that prints thing I tell it not to. Other than that, the program is working fine and smooth. I am upgrading my system from 4GB RAM to 8GB (system max) for a little more speed.

Any reasonable suggestions of a way to switch software in the middle of an already delayed season wiil be considered and appreciated.

Jack

Order Drake unlimited version. Do the conversion from ATX 11 to Drake 2011 (you get all prior releases with a current purchase of drake). Roll data forward.

Pick your two or three most likely to cooperate employees. Pay them to watch Drake videos after hours. I know it is a load, but do it anyway. Give them a small bonus after completing 10 returns in Drake. Once those three are rolling, the others will see how much faster the three are. They will want it.

Do you have more than one EFIN? You need to. Do you have ore than one bank? You need a minimum of two. Does your staff learn fast?

I figure conversion for my 10 professional staff to cost about $4500, software cost included.

I gave them the lecture "We gotta do this, it is not your fault, it is not mine, it just is. The blame game is the voice of victim's and losers, and we do not lose, we win, and we win, and we win. Winning is not the only thing, it is everything. People count on us, believe in us, they pay for what we do. Someone else screwed it, we have to adapt, it is why we get paid. Deal with this, grow with this, and prosper, or leave. We have a move up or out policy, each of you have a choice, and so do I. I hired winners, and you are, as long a you choose to be. Clients do not pay us to use ATX, they pay us to get a job done, we are going to do that, all who are willing to live up to that, we have a great life in front of us, those unwilling to do so should leave now and we will mail your lat check to you".

It was far, far more than needed to make them switch, but it made them on fire to switch. They see the challenge and embraced it. We are truning out a lot of returns now. And results are all that matter.

[JohnH]

Jack in Ohio, I like JohnH's suggestion about having 2 programs. If you or the other partners aren't keen on doing this at the firm this year, you could purchase the second software on a pay-per-return basis with minimal cash outlay for those returns that you prepare outside the firm to test it out yourself and also to become familiar with it. You could also limp through this season with ATX and test out new programs in the summer when the workload is somewhat less. Some vendors will give the prior year program as a free trial. You could take a few of the most basic returns you do and recreate them on the new software. You'd have the original return to compare results, look of the product, and the time to prepare them in each program.

Any software you try will be a learning experience, but remember that we are going through that each year with ATX too. Yes, most of the program is similar in appearance to prior years, but each year there have been changes that we have to learn along with the workarounds that are necessary or the shortcuts that make us faster. I think you will find that after preparing just a few returns with new software that you will be more comfortable with it. You might even find some features that are helpful to you that ATX doesn't provide.

Great suggestions.

I'd add one more to them.

Why wait until after tax season?

It would be easy enough to set up a stand-alone computer, purchase the prime candidate for a secondary vendor on a pay-per-return basis & install on that computer, assign one person to operate it, and give that person the simplest returns while they develop proficiency.

Who knows what could happen?

It might even turn out that the dreaded switch from a forms-based program might not be so difficult for some people once they prepare a return or two.

Or it might be that if serious problems pop up or persist with the primary vendor, that computer might be the only one producing any revenue. Wonder what might happen next?

==========================================

Edit - Or just follow the excellent advice from "Numbers"

That's obviously a workable plan, and a great motivational lecture as well - "If you'll agree to learn to use the new software, you get to keep your job..."

[jklcpa]

I made the suggestion about after tax season only because Jack thinks it's too late to handle conversions at his firm with some software vendors doing conversions out of house.

I'm switching to Drake in the next day or so because I only have a few returns in so far, so converting at this point in my season won't be an issue. I already have their 2011 full functioning software that I've recreated my own personal and corporate return with, and I did that with watching only a couple of their training videos that were 8-10 minutes each. Once I do the conversion, I'll be watching more of those and looking at the manual more closely. Honestly, doing those 2 returns hardly took any more time than ATX would, and that was using a program totally unfamiliar to me.

I've played with it some more and found features that ATX doesn't offer that will help me, like the multi-case planner as just one example. I'll see if Drake's depreciation is enough for me to use in the accounting side of my practice. Until ATX started calculating future year reports, I've always kept using Tompson Reuters Fixed Asset II, but if Drake will give needed reports, then that might save me some more money but I'm not counting on that.

In fairness to Drake, I made several observations when I first tried it that weren't totally accurate. I've since found that using the ESC key backs out of the return view screen (or other screens too) an allows the user to go back to input after viewing the return without exiting out of the file. I was doing it wrong and had to reopen the file each time. Opening return files is fast with almost no delay.

Several other features that I like are that with printing a pdf using Drake's pdf printer, the program automatically creates the appropriate file and saves it in their document manager program with just that one click. Drake also will create random PINs on the signature forms, has a daily scheduler with ability to use for a firm with multiple preparers, and a simple loan amortization schedule generator. I'm sure I'll discover much more when I really get into it.

[jklcpa]

Numbers, why the need for 2 EFINs?

[Numbers]

Numbers, why the need for 2 EFINs?

Strange things happen. IRS pulled one of the guys in my tax group while he was waiting for back ground check on EA license. It was January, cost him about $200K in income. Never trust any one item system when a government is involved.

A to separate software, it makes the set up easier, you can get one set up with one EFIN, the other with the other, and then set up two banks, one existing with ATX, one with DRAKE. Simply makes things safer when the world craps all over us. Like CCH did.

[cnccpas]

After seeing the reference to ProSystem fx, i followed up on it and from what i seen from the live demo, this is the division of CCH with the brains. Can't wait for the local demo to arrive so i can test it out. Even on the consultant's laptop in citrix meeting, the program was flying through the forms and system. They also have a remarkable program simply called Scan, with Autoflow, now just to find out how much the puppy in the window cost. It was very impressive, all data was in one location with the program and had been so for all past years loaded. The research integration looks top notch, any an every single blank or check box fully detailed in the help system too, even the worksheets. Thanks for the suggestion!

[joanmcq]

Someone posted on another board that Lacerte was the Caddilac of tax software. Nope, it's Profx. That software was doing stuff back in 2002, when I last used it, that Lacerte wasn't even dreaming of a few years later.

It's pricey. But when I see what Proseries and Lacerte are charging PPR, if you can get Profx for similar, there's just no comparison.

[cnccpas]

i just loaded 12.7 update and the program crashes more. it crashes when typing in the client search field. i crashes if you click too quickly or are impatient. i will say that for a previously saved return, it finally opened the return up in 30 secs this time on my server. getting better BUT, it still is sluggish and feels totally unstable and you are just waiting for it to hour glass and crash. the program hangs when closing too in the background and eventually crashes. if you click mark all or unmark all, give a minute or two even though you think its not busy anymore lol. i'm thinking after april 15th profx it is.

[jklcpa]

You are correct about ProSysFx. I used it a long time ago, way before desktop pcs, when it was called Computax and we had to fill out input sheets and send to the company for processing. Anyone remember that? Then they wrote for inhouse data entry & upload for processing by them, and it still handled everything flawlessly. Then using it totally inhouse was a dream!

I loaded ATX 12.7 and am having crashes again too. I just purchased the Drake as PPR to get going and will wait for the refund from CCH.

The Drake rep said they've had a large influx of ATX customers again last night and today, so they knew some more bad things must have happened with the program today.

[Numbers]

After seeing the reference to ProSystem fx, i followed up on it and from what i seen from the live demo, this is the division of CCH with the brains. Can't wait for the local demo to arrive so i can test it out. Even on the consultant's laptop in citrix meeting, the program was flying through the forms and system. They also have a remarkable program simply called Scan, with Autoflow, now just to find out how much the puppy in the window cost. It was very impressive, all data was in one location with the program and had been so for all past years loaded. The research integration looks top notch, any an every single blank or check box fully detailed in the help system too, even the worksheets. Thanks for the suggestion!

You will not be happy long, the problem, is not ,and never was ATX, its CCH. They have a structural problem of not developing software and rolling it out before it is ready. They have a MASSIVE ethics problem. ATX is not, and never was, the problem.

[Lee B]

Before you buy any CCH product, you need to read the August 8th issue of The Progressive Accountant about the issues the

overall CCH organization has been having for the last 3 years.

[TheBigBooper]

I switched to Drake last summer at one of their free seminars and bought the software at 35% off that day. Late in December I got a call from ATX sales asking why I had not renewed. I mentioned how slow and clunky the 2010 and 21011 ATX versions were and she told me that the 2012 would be much improved. HAH! It is terrifying to read this forum because ATX was slow and time-wasting even with the earlier and better versions. I hated having to select the forms to use with a new client with rentals, Cs, Ds and multi states. And that was with a better functioning 2011 program.

After a half dozen Drake returns I can state that Drake is far superior to 2011 ATX not to mention the serious problems reported here on this forum.

Before ATX I had used Lacerte and still use it on a PPR basis because ATX couldn't handle a dozen large multi-state returns.lIt appears that Drake might be able toi handle those and will convert the Lacerte files.

Yippee!

[joanmcq]

I test drove Drake two years ago and found a major flaw in the CA calc with a 2555. I had already heard the CA module was weak and that confirmed it. I also read both Drake & Lacerte were allowing exiles when the 8667 wasn't filled out. ATX has been warning about the 8667 even before this year.