The Dilemma

[rfassett]

I watched the movie (The Dilemma) on TV last night not at all thinking I would be facing a dilemma today. I just got my renewal in the mail today and realized my renewal discount is worth nearly $300. I have stated previously that I do not make a practice of early renewing, but $300 can buy a lot of lunches during the year. And if I am going to write a check in six months anyway, why not save the $300. I really need to think this through. As I have mentioned before, I did not have alot of the issues that some of you had this year. And that 10% discount equates to a 21.2% return on the investment according to my amortization program. In other words, if I invested the discount amount on May 31st and received the non-discounted amount back on November 30th, it would represent a 21.2% return for that 6 month period. On the other hand, I could forgo the discount and just pay the non-discounted price as late as possible. I would never achieve that kind of return though while my money waited to be spent. I was able to pay a small downpayment in early December last year and the balance in February (with the payment date actually being pushed further into February because of the filing issues). I am torn but am leaning toward the early renewal. I know this issue has been beat up in other threads, but I am just now starting to think this through rationally. The only real down side would be that I would lose whatever return I could get on the money for six to nine months (or whatever would be the amount of time it would take to get a refund). From a rational perspective, I think I am leaning toward the early renewal. Any thoughts?

[Catherine]

My question would be can you get every penny of that early payment back if CCH does not have an ATX product next year -- or will it "merely" be available to apply to another CCH product? If the latter, would you be happy with TaxWise -> or ProSystem on a PPR basis?

[rfassett]

I do not really have that concern. CCH has weathered many storms over the years. ATX has been a very good money maker for CCH. When it stops being a money maker, CCH will either sell it, merge it, or kill it - whichever makes most economic sense. CCH will not make that decision based on one year's performance given the circumstances. If the writing is on the wall that ATX is going to be a perpetual money loser for CCH, then it would be time to bail. I may be naive, but I do not see that happening this year. This year was an anamoly for ATX and not much more of less, in my opinion.

[Pacun]

I agree.. ATX solved so many issues this season that for the next 3 seasons only little maintenance will be required. I had no issues whatsoever this year, so I would go with an early renewal but I have not seen anything on the mail yet.

I also said on another post that people who left ATX this year will be back in 2 years. Let's see what happens.

[Guest Taxed]

If you are leaning towards ATX because you feel you can manage the problems in your setup and jumping ship at this time is a hassle for you for any # of reasons grab the discount. As you said it is worth 21.2% return.

BUT if you were so disgusted with ATX that you MUST switch software then waiting may be a small price to pay until you cmplete your evaluation of other software.

2014 will tell if ATX is going to be around for the long haul. If enough people do not renew and they can not get sufficient # of new users, I am sure CCH will do a cost analysis and make a quick decision to stop the cash drain! Remember CCH has 2 other products and they will not hang their hat on a money loser!

[Jack from Ohio]

My question would be can you get every penny of that early payment back if CCH does not have an ATX product next year -- or will it "merely" be available to apply to another CCH product? If the latter, would you be happy with TaxWise -> or ProSystem on a PPR basis?

Exactly the reason I will not put out even $.01 until I know the software will be viable for 2013. rfassett, you are giving in to sales talk and not logic. 2012 was not an anomoly, it was a tragic blunder that has not yet been fixed.

[Thigpen]

No dilemma on my part, I would not stay with this program if they GAVE it to me.

[jklcpa]

I got my renewal in the mail today and I am no longer a user. You will NOT get every penny back because the "processing fee" is not refundable.

I renewed on 5/27 last year at $1700 ($1779 - $178 discount + $99 processing). My refund from ATX was $1601 and didn't show up on my credit card until 3/30/13 even though the ATX website showed it was refunded on 3/13, the date it was approved by their accounting dept. It took another 2 weeks to release the funds after numerous calls to them and my credit card company.

Technically I only processed one return through ATX server even though I had some dummy and real returns in the works with a variety of problems. The one return I processed was considered free and ATX refunded my purchase price without charging me the $20 per return fee, but they kept the $99 processing fee. That one return really cost me $99 plus the amount I could have made on a $1700 investment, plus the amount it cost in postage to send their materials back (per their refund policy) and then Kimmie said that wasn't necessary!

[MsTabbyKats]

I'm from the TRX crowd. And I would never go back to them...even for free.

In the course of life, is $300 with a 21.2% return worth potential headaches?

I think you are over analyzing this.

But, if you take it, do you know their refund policy? Is it in writing?

[jklcpa]

But, if you take it, do you know their refund policy? Is it in writing?

Yes, their refund policy is in writing and right before the 2/28 deadline for requesting the refund CCH SFS extended it to the end of March, so they changed it mid-season (yes, more time allowance, but they changed it nonetheless.) Had I known that it was to be extended I would have paid for a lesser rate of postage to send their "materials" back to them instead of paying a higher price to make sure the package was in their hands before 2/28. The day after I mailed it was the day they changed their policy and Kimmie told me that sending them back wasn't necessary! Still mad over that.

[JohnH]

True, it's 21%, but it's still only $300 actual dollar bills no matter how many ways you crunch the numbers. Even in normal times it would be risky, and in this environment it's beyond anything approaching normal risk. I'd look at it as the equivalent of a single tax return (or maybe a couple of small ones). So is it worth risking all the aggravation of one or two tax return preparation fees to expose yourself to the potential headaches?

Personally, I've never taken the discount with ATX and never regretted it. So this year, when the chips were down, I was able to make a good business decision unencumbered by any worries about money sunk in a rat hole. I walked away without any financial considerations to distract me - just moved on. It was a good feeling.

[Guest Taxed]

I got my renewal in the mail today and I am no longer a user. You will NOT get every penny back because the "processing fee" is not refundable.

I renewed on 5/27 last year at $1700 ($1779 - $178 discount + $99 processing). My refund from ATX was $1601 and didn't show up on my credit card until 3/30/13 even though the ATX website showed it was refunded on 3/13, the date it was approved by their accounting dept. It took another 2 weeks to release the funds after numerous calls to them and my credit card company.

Technically I only processed one return through ATX server even though I had some dummy and real returns in the works with a variety of problems. The one return I processed was considered free and ATX refunded my purchase price without charging me the $20 per return fee, but they kept the $99 processing fee. That one return really cost me $99 plus the amount I could have made on a $1700 investment, plus the amount it cost in postage to send their materials back (per their refund policy) and then Kimmie said that wasn't necessary!

Is it really necessary to charge $99 processing fee? I can see a nominal charge for shipping and handling of the CD but $99 is way too much.

I looked at the Drake renewal form and they will charge $59 fee ONLY if you want all final updates in CD. If you just get the pre-season CD and download all the updates the $59 does not apply. I think that is fair!

[joanmcq]

Ron, I've negotiated the 10% discount later in the season. In fact for 2010 ( the year i evaluated Drake), i dont think i renewed with atx until late September and still got the 10% discount. With so many jumping ship, I think missing the early discount date won't be an issue. They want us to come back!

[jklcpa]

Joan might be correct. The very day in March that I got my ATX refund back against my credit card, I also received a call from an ATX sales rep. My rep is no longer with the company, and this gentleman wanted to know if I could be enticed to come back to ATX.