ATX Offer to Win $5000 moved up to June 20

[mcb39]

:unsure: Below is an excerpt from an e-mail that I just received from ATX. Read whatever you want to into it. I no longer completely trust them; but I have a great deal of admiration for their software. I have to hope that they won't regress in quality of product.

Dear ATXer,

You know that you can receive a 10% discount if you renew your ATX software by June 30. Well, if you renew by June 20, 2007, you'll be automatically entered in a drawing for one of three prizes.$5,000, $3,000 and $2,000.

That's right.we're giving away a total of $10,000 to three ATXers just for renewing early this year. You don't often get the chance to win a lot of cash for doing something you were going to do anyway.

[JohnH]

This is all well & good, but I want to know when they are going to throw in a coffee pot or toaster with every renewal?

[mcb39]

Remember the useless airline tickets of a few years back? In any event, I don't need a new coffee pot, but could use a toaster. John, my take is that renewals may not be coming in as fast as they would like. They need to plan on how much revenue they will have for development. But, they threw us out with the bath water and now they would like our loyalty back. Am still thinking this one over....

[JohnH]

Marilyn:

Same here - still thinking it over.

However, I made the decision weeks ago that I won't be taking any "Early Renewal" offers from ATX or anyone else - don't plan to make the final decision until 4th quarter. I don't think the $100 or so of savings is worth the risk of making a mistake. In the meantime I'm evaluating other software as a precaution and have already arranged a conversion if I decide to switch to one of the competitors.

BTW, as I recall the airline ticket class action was actually a clever marketing scheme coupled with a unique way to solve a potential legal problem gthe airlines had at the time.

[TAXBILLY]

Perhaps they are getting a wee bit nervous?? I say let them sweat.

taxbilly

[Pacun]

How about if no one renew early? Will this hurt us since no money will be available to improve the program at the beginning of the cycle? Imagine (as a company), you are at the beginning of a venture, is it better for the consumers if the company knows for sure that will have 40,000 user or if the company thinks that will have only 20,000 users in January 2008.

[JohnH]

Pacun:

That's an interesting question, but I can only answer for myself.

I'm only responsible for my bottom line, not ATX's. As long as they have competitors, it's their responsibility to invest the necessary resources to insure that their product is as good as or better than their competitors' offerings in all areas of service, performance, price, reliability, customer satisfaction, etc.

If they became a monopoly my answer might be different, but in that case we wouldn't even need to have this discussion.

[mcb39]

An interesting question, indeed. However, I believe that many will renew early as $100 means a lot to many people. Unless you are getting in excess of 10% interest on your savings, a frugal person would want to save that 10% if their intention is to renew eventually. On the other hand,; ATX might be getting nervous as the renewals are probably not coming in as fast as they had hoped or expected. If they are monitoring this board (?), they know that many of their customers are looking elsewhere, whereas in prior years there was no reason or desire to do so.

Remembeer, though, that many, many of their subscribers don't even know about the controversy as they not only never used, but never heard of the ATX Community board. I can only hope that they continue to provide a useful, affordable and very workable product for the small businesses who will be forced out if they cannot justify purchasing tax software. That would include me; but I am old enough to call it quits even though I really wouldn't want to at this point....

[kcjenkins]

Apparently their first 'contest' offer did not get enough responses, since originally they made it for May 31st deadline. I've decided to renew, after looking at the other options, so I will take advantage of this offer. As Marilyn says, the discount may not be a lot, but it's still enough to be a good deal, IMHO.

[Gail in Virginia]

I had already renewed in May, after calling and hearing about the drawing for those who renewed by the end of May. I had intended to renew in time for the discount anyway since I have yet to find a software that I liked as well for the money. I am wondering if they are now going to have two drawings (not likely, IMO) or if they have just made a "business decision" to change my odds after the fact. Surely there will be people who renewed after May 31 (the date I was told was the deadline) and June 20 (the new deadline to participate in this "lottery".) <_<

[PapaJoe]

I renewed early a couple of years ago. (Yes, I know it was the "old" ATX then and not the new CCH ATX.) Then in November the ATX board was full of comments regarding the new year's software that everybody was receiving. One poster even stated something like "I ordered on Monday and got my new software on Wednesday." I had ordered in May and was still wondering where my copy of the software was. Folks who waited until November were receiving their orders before me who ordered in May. That was my first and last time to give my money to ATX early. I'll probably renew with ATX, but I won't buy till fall.

[iratax]

I switched to Drake. Their price increase would have put me into MAX instead of 1040 Office. Max is more expensive then Drake and I'll byte the bullet and learn a new program this year instead of next year.

[BulldogTom]

I switched to Drake. Their price increase would have put me into MAX instead of 1040 Office. Max is more expensive then Drake and I'll byte the bullet and learn a new program this year instead of next year.

I met with the Drake people at Super Seminar last weekend. They should have put better salespeople in their booth. I was ready to switch until they opened their mouths, now I am not sure.

Can you tell me what features in the software (not the company) you thought were compelling to make the move from ATX? Price is not a factor for me as Max and Drake costs are so similar that I won't notice the difference. I have loaded the 2006 Drake software and started the setup process and will begin working returns in the next few weeks.

I would appreciate your comments.

PS, now I think I am going to forego both the Drake and ATX early discounts and wait until November. I am not ready to trust ATX, or to switch to a new software yet either.

Tom

Lodi, CA

[Maribeth]

I have looked at several different packages (Drake, Taxslayer, two others) and I still believe I will renew with ATX. I do not care for the input sheet method of data input, as Drake uses, and to be honest, I just don't wish to go through a conversion again. This decision might bite me in the butt in the future, I'm aware, but we'll just have to see.

I am going to renew by the 6/30/07 deadline -- only because I use TTO and the package this year includes the document manager and the trial balance. We need to be able to get the document manager up and running long before December, even though ATX has indicated it won't be shipping the document manager until late summer or early fall, that is still better than December.

Maribeth

[catax]

Regarding evaluating Drake software. I have looked at it seriously over the last month. Mostly due to my emotions a $450 price increase for ATX and the dropping of the bulletin board. I figured if I was spending that much more money maybe there was a better product available for the price.

Things I liked:

Value offered a lot for the price. All my interfaces with staff were professional

[catax]

Regarding evaluating Drake software. I have looked at it seriously over the last month, including attending a 4 hour presentation. Mostly due to my emotions a $450 price increase for ATX and the dropping of the bulletin board. I figured if I was spending that much more money maybe there was a better product available for the price.

Things I liked:

Value offered a lot for the price. All my interfaces with staff were professional

There was a lot of control regarding the way you could print returns, reports, labels

Seemed to be a powerful program overall

I liked all the letters offered in the program (I consistantly have problems with letter with ATX)

Seemed to handle what I input correctly

Things I disliked (or would take some getting used to:

Screen entry - it is counter intuitive for me and would represent a significant learning curve - maybe not for someone else

Seems still a little DOS like with all kinds of short cut commands

Depreciation entry - Had to pick year, type of depreciation, etc., for Fed and State alot of entries here (more than ATX) Seems as if it could be streamlined alot.

Unlike ATX you can't get Federal or State instructions by line. You can get RIA by line and you can get to some of the publications (but not to the specific area you are working on) I use this feature often when working on something out of the ordinary (in ATX)

Things I was hoping Drake would do that ATX does not (Drake doesn't do them either)

CA Renters credit diagnostics. "This client may qualify for the renters credit." or "Hey you didn't check a box did you mean to miss checking it"

Manually entering CA depreciation and other differences throughout the program

Better diagnostics in regard to tax preparation, "Hey tax preparer did you mean to not check this or that"

I also looked at Pro Series but not as indepth. It definately has better diagnostics then both ATX and Drake. It does do the things that I was hoping Drake would do but at yet an even greater price. And you can't network and on and on without paying even more. If Drake had handled the items on my wish list better and dealt with Depreciation a little more smoothly I would have probably considered making the switch and dealing with the learning curve. But since at this time it didn't seem to be necessarily a better program for my practice. I do not feel that the learning curve is worth it for me at this time. This doesn't mean it may not work for you and your practice you may want to try to mess with the things in the demo that I mentioned above it may work better for your specific state. They did mention to me that they are really starting to grow in CA maybe they with improve some things in the future. Hope all my thoughts help someone. Nena Carey, EA

[iratax]

When I redid some of my ATX returns in Drake I found several errors that I made that ATX did not catch. On one of them I accidently changed the 50% in the Schedule A to 17% and ATX limited the deduction to 17%. ATX did not calculate the Oregon Retirement Income Credit correctly. I also use Lacert so I'm used to screen entry as well as forms entry and that is not a big deal to me. Also the Forms that ATX has and Drake does not are not an issure for me.

I also like Drakes Document Manager since I have been paperless for the last few years. From ATX I can't print directly to Adobe Professional but Drake does. That will eliminate a step on every return.

I do mostly 1040's with a lot of e-filing and no bank products. I do enough 1120's and 1041's so that I the increase in PPR would impact me.

Mostly it is ATX's attitude that the small customer does not count anymore. They eliminated the mini-organizer and that is a big deal to me. The fact that they upped the price of the entry level products and hide the increase as well as canceling the forum. Since they call it Universal Tax Systems which is Taxwise to me implies that ATX will disappear and TaxWise will remain.

[mcb39]

For those of you who have shown some questions or concern; here is the last line of the e-mail. I have taken lines out of context only because there is a savings code in the text that may or may not matter. Good Night all........

Your ATX Total Satisfaction Team

P.S. If you have already renewed, then you will be automatically entered in this drawing.

[OldJack]

I am wondering if they are now going to have two drawings (not likely, IMO) or if they have just made a "business decision" to change my odds after the fact. Surely there will be people who renewed after May 31 (the date I was told was the deadline) and June 20 (the new deadline to participate in this "lottery".)

Sounds to me like your odds definitely got changed. Maybe, if we can get enough people together, we can file a class action lawsuit.

Renewing early just to have a chance of winning a prize is quite a joke worthy of ATX management. :D

[JohnH]

Interesting question about the odds changing. It's true that extending the eligibility date would change your ACTUAL odds since more people would be brought into the lottery by extending the eligbility date. But if they didn't have as many sign-ups as they expected initially, then the extension might not change the STATED odds.

Of course, none of this addresses the other issue that OldJack just pointed out, which is the bingo-parlor mentality that their marketing dept brings to the table. I think it's another indication of a particular mind-set under the new management. Maybe this type of stuff works well in Europe. (?)

PS: I hope some of you on this forum who elected to renew early win the prizes, but I'm still holding out for a coffee pot or toaster oven.

[Pacun]

Changing the odds and class action will not fly because the rules of the drawing clearly stated that ATX can cancel, call off, stop, abandon, withdraw, annul, revoke, terminate, rescind, repeal the drawing as they wish. They also can change, alter, modify, vary, transform, revolutionize, adjust, amend your odds as ATX wishes.

Do you see how important is to read the rules of engagement?

I am just kidding... but I believe that somewhere ATX has covered its back and made a disclaimer like the one above.

[redux]

Changing the odds and class action will not fly because the rules of the drawing clearly stated that ATX can cancel, call off, stop, abandon, withdraw, annul, revoke, terminate, rescind, repeal the drawing as they wish. They also can change, alter, modify, vary, transform, revolutionize, adjust, amend your odds as ATX wishes.

Do you see how important is to read the rules of engagement?

Boiler plate one-sided agreements, such as the one stated by Pacun, generally speaking, do not always succeed in court. That said, however, I doubt that any of us would like to expend either the funds or the manpower to pursue a suit for such a small reward that may be available here.

I think John and OldJack have the right idea, about the NEW and Improved ATX's (NIA) attitude toward their clients as well as the low class mentality they have adopted.

I have not made a firm decision about renewal, yes, I know I stated earlier that I decided to "re-up." Call it vacillating, it is. Ever since NIA pulled the rug out from under us I have felt an overwhelming sense of dishonesty, trickery, deceptiveness, and deceit on their part. Not because they canceled the forum, that in and of itself is an insignificant act. It was the method they used that left me with the feelings I have.

Don't think for a minute that this year's ATX software is going to be the SAME as last, or other, years. My profound distrust leaves me wondering just what is going to be in their programs this year. They have so many products that it would make sense for them to "step" them in terms of quality. So, for instance, suppose they decide that the "old" ATX software is going to be their lowest quality product, it would not be a giant step for them to remove some of the features while keeping the price where they have currently advertised them. Other product lines would be a little higher in quality and price and so forth. We, of course, wouldn't know what (if any) features of the "old" ATX software have been removed until we purchase it this year. Think about it folks, does it make sense to have two or more product lines that compete with each other in the same company?

So I too am going to sit this one out. To me, it isn't worth the small savings or other "incentives" they offer. By the way, have you ever noticed that a product that is selling well, such as a car, offers NO incentives. It's when the sales are low and they want to increase the sales that the incentives appear.

I will make my decision later after all the demos have been tested. If my decision later is to stay with NIA, I still won't know anything about the program so I'll still be taking a chance. But that distrust will certainly be part of the calculus of my decision.

So, everyone must make the decision that is best in their mind. I am not suggesting that anyone else take my position, I'm simply sharing thoughts with you as others have done.

[lydia33]

I was waiting to see what most of you guys do on your renewal. I renew early because it saves me money. I hope they do not let us down but in the back of my mind with all the stuff at the end of tax season I am very unsure.

[JohnH]

I was waiting to see what most of you guys do on your renewal. I renew early because it saves me money. I hope they do not let us down but in the back of my mind with all the stuff at the end of tax season I am very unsure.

As stated before, I can't bring myself to renew early this year. It isn't that I have a cavalier attitude about the decision to spend more money. I'm thinking in terms of time invested. I know that the hourly rate any of us bill can range from $80 to $200/hr or more, but assuming a low-side average of $100, the decision becomes whether to make a premature commitment of the value of one hour of time at the risk of making a mistake that will cost many, many hours to correct. Or in dollar terms, I'm deciding to invest an extra $100 in my tax software decision this year by waiting until the last possible minute in hopes that I'll forestall making a $1,000 mistake.

To me, it's an insurance cost rather than a missed discount. (I may change my mind if they up the ante with the coffee pot, toaster oven, or microwave)

[redux]

For those who may be motivated to renew early in order to be entered into the contest, you should realize that renewing is not required in order to enter. The contest rules stipulate: "A purchase is not necessary to enter, and will not improve the chances of winning. To enter without purchase, send a 3x5 card with your contact information to ATX Renewal Contest, P.O. Box 1040, 63 Sweden Street, Caribou, ME 04736. All entries must be postmarked no later than June 20, 2007." Good luck!