Returns "silent" for ACA: box 61 not checked & no 8965 or 8962 - affects fee collect, delays refunds

[jklcpa]

In an earlier topic, Pacun mentioned that it is possible to e-file a return without having box 61 checked. ATX will give a 'yellow' cautionary warning but not a red one, and so the e-file will transmit.  I posted this in General Chat because it is more about the processing of returns and not really any sort of question about the ACA itself.

 

According to the ATX blog earlier this month, for returns that are totally "silent" as to the ACA, meaning that box 61 is blank and no form 8965 or 8962 is included, the IRS will pull the return for error resolution and any refund will be delayed.  If this is an ERC or Fee Collect return, the preparer's fees will not be collected if the IRS chooses to mail the refund as a paper check later, rather than as a direct deposit.

[RitaB]

You know what I did on my single lady with no insurance but below the filing threshold?  Checked the box on 8965 but didn't pull down her name and SSN right below it.  Yep.  Even though they are on the top of the page, and she's the only one on the return.  What do you wanna bet her refund gets delayed?

[jklcpa]

Yes, Rita, it might.

 

I watched that ATX video for the ACA input that I'd posted for someone else, and I was surprised that the worksheet didn't have a checkbox or dropdown to auto-fill the name or to auto-fill all of those boxes if no coverage for all 12 months.

[Pacun]

I think we should force ATX to make the error message RED for silence and yellow for Rita's lack of pulling.

Edited January 26, 2015 by Pacun

[mcb39]

Yes, Rita, it might.

 

I watched that ATX video for the ACA input that I'd posted for someone else, and I was surprised that the worksheet didn't have a checkbox or dropdown to auto-fill the name or to auto-fill all of those boxes if no coverage for all 12 months.

 

Yes, we could only hope!  Nobody's making it easier, but nobody seems to totally understand it.

[Jack from Ohio]

I think we should force ATX to make the error message RED for silence and yellow for Rita's lack of pulling.

I am interested in the process you propose to accomplish this? 

[RitaB]

I am interested in the process you propose to accomplish this? 

 

I have a pen and a phone.  Oh, wait, that doesn't work for us.

[jklcpa]

Yes, we could only hope!  Nobody's making it easier, but nobody seems to totally understand it.

 

Yeah, Jack, I'm not slamming ATX either because so many of their other worksheets are well-designed and so easy to use that it really did take me by surprise.

[Pacun]

When the process makes sense, I bet you they will do it. In this case, it makes sense that if the refunds will be delayed or clients might get a letter about a check mark, you get an error message. When you forget to check the box that reads "did you complete this form from the information provided by the client" when filling out the EIC checklist, you are not able to efile.

[Pacun]

Let give another example, this error on our part, is listed at the same level when we forget to check if client wants to buy or decline protection. The bar needs to be raised for ACA silence.

Edited January 26, 2015 by Pacun

[Jack from Ohio]

When the process makes sense, I bet you they will do it. In this case, it makes sense that if the refunds will be delayed or clients might get a letter about a check mark, you get an error message. when you forget to the check to check the box that reads "did you complete this form from the information provided by the client" when fill out the EIC checklist, you are not able to efile.

 

Let give another example, this error on our part, is listed at the same level when we forget to check if client wants to buy or decline protection. The bar needs to be raised for ACA silence.

We will see how that works for you...  I have first hand knowledge that ATX pays 1% attention to our complaints about adding usability or increasing efficiency.  Three years now, many have demanded 64 bit and the return of templates.  I have no faith in them anymore.

 

"We cannot dedicate resources for requests from a small demographic group of our customers."  This is a quote.

Edited January 26, 2015 by Jack from Ohio

[Pacun]

"Demanded 64 bit"... That's a little bit for you right?

[mcb39]

In defense of ATX, I have to note that when I take a peek at the ATX Original Board; ATX reps are on there answering questions to the extent that I have never seen in all the years I have used the product.  I spend very little time there because so many of the questions are from the new users asking for help with things that most of us have known for years.   There don't seem to be a lot of tax questions; more along the line of software questions and the support gals are jumping right in there.

[Pacun]

In defense of ATX, I have to note that when I take a peek at the ATX Original Board; ATX reps are on there answering questions to the extent that I have never seen in all the years I have used the product.  I spend very little time there because so many of the questions are from the new users asking for help with things that most of us have known for years.   There don't seem to be a lot of tax questions; more along the line of software questions and the support gals are jumping right in there.

 

Do you mind asking them to change the message from yellow to red? I have only contacted ATX 2 times in 10 years of usage of their software.

[BulldogTom]

In defense of ATX, I have to note that when I take a peek at the ATX Original Board; ATX reps are on there answering questions to the extent that I have never seen in all the years I have used the product.  I spend very little time there because so many of the questions are from the new users asking for help with things that most of us have known for years.   There don't seem to be a lot of tax questions; more along the line of software questions and the support gals are jumping right in there.

 

I peeked over there this weekend and I was reading the ACA board.  I was shocked at the answers that ATX was giving on the ACA.  Much of it was related to the entry in the software, but there was some that resembled telling people what the ACA law says and how to apply it in the tax return.

 

Interesting.

 

Tom

Newark, CA

[mcb39]

I peeked over there this weekend and I was reading the ACA board.  I was shocked at the answers that ATX was giving on the ACA.  Much of it was related to the entry in the software, but there was some that resembled telling people what the ACA law says and how to apply it in the tax return.

 

Interesting.

 

Tom

Newark, CA

 

Yes, I noticed that too.  Did you have the feeling that their answers were correct or not?  This subject is causing mass confusion.

[BulldogTom]

I felt like they may not have had enough information from the poster to give the answers they were giving.  That being said, they seem to have made a conscious effort to be up on the ACA as it relates to the tax return.  I saw something that they were planning to include the affordability worksheets in the software in the next update this week because it is so hard to do this outside the software on the worksheets in the instructions.

 

Crossing my fingers that this is true because the affordability exception seems to be causing the most headaches for preparers on that board.

 

Tom

Newark, CA

[RitaB]

You know what I did on my single lady with no insurance but below the filing threshold?  Checked the box on 8965 but didn't pull down her name and SSN right below it.  Yep.  Even though they are on the top of the page, and she's the only one on the return.  What do you wanna bet her refund gets delayed?

 

OK, now I think my lack of pulling was alright as the option that applies to her is not listed, and I get a red error message if I fill in name and SSN and leave the exemption blank.  So I guess we'll see.  This is Science, y'all!

[Tax Prep by Deb]

I had a similar situation and I really think that if you are choosing the option that they are below the filing threshold it puts a checkmark in that box and that's all there is to it.  If you are choosing any other exemption you have to fill out the next section were you pull the name and social security number and insert a code for the reason.

 

This stumped me because it felt too easy, but went back and read the instructions and this is what it seems to imply.  So here's hoping we did it right!

[easytax]

In an earlier topic, Pacun mentioned that it is possible to e-file a return without having box 61 checked. ATX will give a 'yellow' cautionary warning but not a red one, and so the e-file will transmit.  I posted this in General Chat because it is more about the processing of returns and not really any sort of question about the ACA itself.

 

According to the ATX blog earlier this month, for returns that are totally "silent" as to the ACA, meaning that box 61 is blank and no form 8965 or 8962 is included, the IRS will pull the return for error resolution and any refund will be delayed.  If this is an ERC or Fee Collect return, the preparer's fees will not be collected if the IRS chooses to mail the refund as a paper check later, rather than as a direct deposit.

 

 

I think we should force ATX to make the error message RED for silence and yellow for Rita's lack of pulling.

 

 

Do you mind asking them to change the message from yellow to red? I have only contacted ATX 2 times in 10 years of usage of their software.

 

 

 I saw something that they were planning to include the affordability worksheets in the software in the next update this week because it is so hard to do this outside the software on the worksheets in the instructions.

 

Crossing my fingers that this is true because the affordability exception seems to be causing the most headaches for preparers on that board.

 

Tom

Newark, CA

 

The yellow to red question was asked:   Answer is basically that since IRS allows the submission (e-file) of the return without the check mark, ATX CANNOT enforce it to a red box as red means it cannot be e-filed --- as stated it goes to a "review" state but WILL accept through e-file --- ATX is prevented from enforcing something NOT there - it CAN BE e-filed.

 

Supposedly the "affordability forms" will be added this week (I believe next update is Thursday). This will be along with adding several drop down boxes showing tax payers, etc. (if I understood properly) in the various sections of the two ACA forms. There is also some mention of them adding (automatically when required) the cost of the bronze plan and lowest silver plan where appropriate too.

[Jack from Ohio]

So we have to think now, instead of depending upon the software to check everything for us.  THIS is a REMARKABLE idea!!!

[Pacun]

The yellow to red question was asked:   Answer is basically that since IRS allows the submission (e-file) of the return without the check mark, ATX CANNOT enforce it to a red box as red means it cannot be e-filed --- as stated it goes to a "review" state but WILL accept through e-file --- ATX is prevented from enforcing something NOT there - it CAN BE e-filed.

 

Supposedly the "affordability forms" will be added this week (I believe next update is Thursday). This will be along with adding several drop down boxes showing tax payers, etc. (if I understood properly) in the various sections of the two ACA forms. There is also some mention of them adding (automatically when required) the cost of the bronze plan and lowest silver plan where appropriate too.

 

That makes sense. I forgot the requirements from the IRS to the EROs and they have to follow the IRS rules imposed on them.

[grmy2h]

on the official board ATX Kristin is conducting a poll:

 

No to adding an error message regarding ACA  or

Yes to adding an error message regarding ACA

 

Currently the vote is

22 - yes

5 - no

[Chowdahead]

Why are you guys e-mailing any returns with the ACA question being in yellow?  I always resolve that question by either asking the client if they had full year coverage, or selecting the appropriate exemption or calculating the Shared Responsibility payment on the the 8965,

 

I haven't needed to use the 8962 yet because I have yet to have a client with the 1095-A.  I told them all to wait until they receive the form after Jan. 31..

[Pacun]

Why are you guys e-mailing any returns with the ACA question being in yellow?  I always resolve that question by either asking the client if they had full year coverage, or selecting the appropriate exemption or calculating the Shared Responsibility payment on the the 8965,

 

 

 

One day you will forget or you will think you forgot and you will go and check a return that was efiled. It is just a matter of time... believe me.