I found out how much longer I can be "Nice"

[RitaB]

Lady brings her very nice summary of business expenses AND THE GOOD OLE ACCORDIAN FILE WITH ALL HER RECEIPTS.  She goofs around I mean sells crafts.  I see an asset on the sheet mixed in with everything.

Me:  When did you buy this sewing machine?

She:  Oh, the receipt is in there.

Me:  When did you buy this sewing machine?

She gave me a date.  It could be wrong.  Neither of us cared.

 

I was sorta "Nice" not giving her a hug, right?

[Possi]

3 minutes ago, RitaB said:

Lady brings her very nice summary of business expenses AND THE GOOD OLE ACCORDIAN FILE WITH ALL HER RECEIPTS.  She goofs around I mean sells crafts.  I see an asset on the sheet mixed in with everything.

Me:  When did you buy this sewing machine?

She:  Oh, the receipt is in there.

Me:  When did you buy this sewing machine?

She gave me a date.  It could be wrong.  Neither of us cared.

 

I was sorta "Nice" not giving her a hug, right?

You were VERY nice not giving her a hug. Have you been hitting the cough syrup again?

[FDNY]

And she doesn't even know how nice you were, or appreciate not getting to see the backyard.

[RitaB]

28 minutes ago, Possi said:

You were VERY nice not giving her a hug. Have you been hitting the cough syrup again?

"Jello Shots"

[joanmcq]

Damn, I just did an MFS/MFJ worksheet because this couple keeps income separate and they want to see how much of the tax is generated by each. So all of a sudden, MFS is lower by a substantial amount. Think it might have something to do with the AMT fix that through for 2014. MFS requires so much more work in ATX. And I was about to shove this one off my desk. 

I'm doing several MFS already because of student loan repayment schedules and high medical....more than I've done in all my years of doing tax. Argh!  I just want to get the damn things done at this point!  Why do I have to be frikkin meticulous at this point! 

[mcb39]

I found out how much longer I can be Nice, yesterday.  Had a woman in tears (literally) because she insists that because she got married on Dec 12, she HAS to file single.  Husband just sat there shaking his head.  Neither one of them were prepared.  He did not have an accounting of the estimates that he paid and neither one of them had their papers from the Marketplace.  She said the lady from the Marketplace told her that it didn't matter how she filed, but she would end up with a huge penalty if she didn't file single.  I see an extension on the horizon.  After they left, I waited for one more pickup and then took a nap.  Never came back to my computer until this AM.  Right now, I would like to tip the desk over and let the papers fall where they may.

[Jack from Ohio]

32 minutes ago, mcb39 said:

I found out how much longer I can be Nice, yesterday.  Had a woman in tears (literally) because she insists that because she got married on Dec 12, she HAS to file single.  Husband just sat there shaking his head.  Neither one of them were prepared.  He did not have an accounting of the estimates that he paid and neither one of them had their papers from the Marketplace.  She said the lady from the Marketplace told her that it didn't matter how she filed, but she would end up with a huge penalty if she didn't file single.  I see an extension on the horizon.  After they left, I waited for one more pickup and then took a nap.  Never came back to my computer until this AM.  Right now, I would like to tip the desk over and let the papers fall where they may.

Don't you just love it when insurance people give out tax advice? 

I still feel privileged that our Government has seen fit to appoint me to be the enforcer of their absolutely atrocious insurance laws.

[Randall]

2 hours ago, joanmcq said:

I'm doing several MFS already because of student loan repayment schedules and high medical....more than I've done in all my years of doing tax. Argh!  I just want to get the damn things done at this point!  Why do I have to be frikkin meticulous at this point! 

Has anyone heard about the student loan repayment schedules that will be lower based on MFS income being lower for the one with the loans?  New client couple tell me they need to file separately regardless of higher tax because their loan repayment will be much lower.  And they say they have to file separately every year because the repayment schedule will be reviewed every year.

[Jack from Ohio]

15 minutes ago, Randall said:

Has anyone heard about the student loan repayment schedules that will be lower based on MFS income being lower for the one with the loans?  New client couple tell me they need to file separately regardless of higher tax because their loan repayment will be much lower.  And they say they have to file separately every year because the repayment schedule will be reviewed every year.

The repayment system has a flaw.  If the person files separately, only their income is use to calculate the payment they can afford.  One spouse could be earning $200K, and the one with student loans earns $30K.  If they file separately, the repayment schedule is based on the $30K income.

I personally am offended by this type of action. These people game the system and cause the rest of us that pay according to our actual income.   Same for the spouse that wants to file separately so her husband's unpaid child support does not snag her return.  When did it become a smart move to marry a man with multiple thousands of dollars in unpaid child support? 

RANT OVER!

[JohnH]

This is the first I've heard of student loan repayment schedules being lower when people file MFS.  Maybe it's because most of my clients are old (like me), and student loans aren't in their financial mix.  But I've never run across this even among my younger & middle-age clients.  

Anyhow, here's my question.  Does the lower payment come with a lower interest rate?  If not, then that means they are probably paying more income tax solely for the purpose of getting a lower monthly payment.  Sounds like false economy to me, since the additional taxes are essentially an increase in their 'effective' interest rate  (their true all-in cost of borrowing money).  

But I guess if they fall for that, they are the same people who routinely sign up for  7-year auto loans or fool themselves into thinking that leasing a car is more economical than buying.  Or those who do serial refinancing, paying exorbitant transaction costs to ratchet down their home mortgage rate a few points without regard for the payback period.  I guess there is a pattern there. 

[RitaB]

1 hour ago, Jack from Ohio said:

Don't you just love it when insurance people give out tax advice? 

I still feel privileged that our Government has seen fit to appoint me to be the enforcer of their absolutely atrocious insurance laws.

Three out of three of my Surprise! repayment of PTC (which does not break my heart, BTW)  went to the same insurance salesman in this town.  He got a little attitude with me when I spoke to him on the phone, saying he wasn't making any money on these ACA clients.  I said, "Well, imagine how accountants feel.  We're actually having to learn about it."

[RitaB]

2 hours ago, mcb39 said:

I found out how much longer I can be Nice, yesterday.  Had a woman in tears (literally) because she insists that because she got married on Dec 12, she HAS to file single.  Husband just sat there shaking his head. 

I was pretty fed up with a separated couple, professional counselors mind you.  The husband couldn't get his head out of his own @$$ long enough to realize that you are super "Nice" and appreciative to the tax lady that saved you from tax suicide. 

Do not have an attitude with me because your wife picked me.  She picked you, too. 

Their friend, my client, referred them to me.  She called me and said to send the invoice to her because they were fighting over that, too.

[JohnH]

I've only had a few clients over the years who actually questioned the bill.  But in those cases I've always followed the advice to ask them "What do you think it should be?"  They never have an answer, other than to say it should be less.  So they don't have any idea of what's reasonable, but they are absolutely sure the existing charge is unreasonable.  How stupid & illogical can someone be?   (Don't answer that...)

Anyhow, my response has always been to tell them to decide what's fair and send a check for that amount.  I think in all these years only one person actually sent less than the amount billed.  But in almost every case I made sure they went somewhere else the next year.  If they didn't do so voluntarily, I took the initiative - usuallly by calling it to their attention next time around (if there was going to be one), and pointing out it will be larger the current year if all work is about the same as the year before.   

They need to know & acknowledge you're in the business to make a profit, not just to earn a wage.  I don't want to do business with someone who doesn't trust me to charge them appropriately, and I don't want to do business with someone who is opposed to me making a profit.  No sense being bashful about that.  

[Catherine]

4 minutes ago, JohnH said:

Anyhow, my response has always been to tell them to decide what's fair and send a check for that amount.  I think in all these years only one person actually sent less than the amount billed.  

I tried that exactly once.  It was a lawyer -- who bills as much per HOUR as my entire fee was -- and he paid half.  I did not invite him back the next year and frankly if he offered $1,000 per return going forward I wouldn't take him back.  The level of disrespect shown to another professional was astounding.   

[RitaB]

9 minutes ago, Catherine said:

I tried that exactly once.  It was a lawyer -- who bills as much per HOUR as my entire fee was -- and he paid half.  I did not invite him back the next year and frankly if he offered $1,000 per return going forward I wouldn't take him back.  The level of disrespect shown to another professional was astounding.   

I know.  I listened to my attorney and his attorney friend discussing which accountant they could hire for cheap to prepare exhibits for court.  While he is charging me huge fees, he is talking about trying to find a cheap accountant.  Hello?  We already charge less than you, and that's if you invoice in human hours, not dog hours, which is what I suspect you do.  Anyhow, he says to other lawyer, the guy I've been using is good, but he's not as good as she is (pointing to me).  I wasn't smug at all.  And I hugged him.  And I meant it.  I really did.

[JohnH]

10 minutes ago, Catherine said:

I tried that exactly once.  It was a lawyer -- who bills as much per HOUR as my entire fee was -- and he paid half.  I did not invite him back the next year and frankly if he offered $1,000 per return going forward I wouldn't take him back.  The level of disrespect shown to another professional was astounding.   

Whatever amount he stiffed you for was well worth the investment.  If he cheated you out of $500, you learned enough about his lack of character to insure that he would never have a chance to cheat you out of $5,000 (which he probably would do if given the chance).  That's valuable information to have about anyone with whom you might be doing business in the future.  Some people are are so insecure that they simply MUST get things over on others, usuallly as a way to validate their own self-worth.  Best to identify them early in the relationship and steer clear of them forever afterward.

[JohnH]

10 minutes ago, RitaB said:

I know.  I listened to my attorney and his attorney friend discussing which accountant they could hire for cheap to prepare exhibits for court.  While he is charging me huge fees, he is talking about trying to find a cheap accountant.  Hello?  We already charge less than you, and that's if you invoice in human hours, not dog hours, which is what I suspect you do.  Anyhow, he says to other lawyer, the guy I've been using is good, but he's not as good as she is (pointing to me).  I wasn't smug at all.  And I hugged him.  And I meant it.  I really did.

Rita, if I ever meet you and you try to hug me, please don't be offended if I politely decline.  Or even if I run the other way screaming "Somebody save me!"

[Lion EA]

Just don't run toward her backyard.

[Catherine]

2 hours ago, JohnH said:

Best to identify them early in the relationship and steer clear of them forever afterward.

EXACTLY.  Well worth losing half the fee to get rid of the bozo before he tried causing more trouble down the road.  Funny, every time I think my opinion of lawyers can't sink any lower, something like this incident proves me wrong.

[jasdlm]

6 minutes ago, Catherine said:

EXACTLY.  Well worth losing half the fee to get rid of the bozo before he tried causing more trouble down the road.  Funny, every time I think my opinion of lawyers can't sink any lower, something like this incident proves me wrong.

I know you meant to say 'excluding jasdlm, who is top notch, always' and brings a breath of fresh air to the legal profession!  

[Catherine]

Just now, jasdlm said:

I know you meant to say 'excluding jasdlm, who is top notch, always' and brings a breath of fresh air to the legal profession!  

And KC, and my pal Wendy.... those who prove the case by the exceptions!

[Richcpaman]

12 hours ago, JohnH said:

This is the first I've heard of student loan repayment schedules being lower when people file MFS.  Maybe it's because most of my clients are old (like me), and student loans aren't in their financial mix.  But I've never run across this even among my younger & middle-age clients.  

Anyhow, here's my question.  Does the lower payment come with a lower interest rate?  If not, then that means they are probably paying more income tax solely for the purpose of getting a lower monthly payment.  Sounds like false economy to me, since the additional taxes are essentially an increase in their 'effective' interest rate  (their true all-in cost of borrowing money).  

But I guess if they fall for that, they are the same people who routinely sign up for  7-year auto loans or fool themselves into thinking that leasing a car is more economical than buying.  Or those who do serial refinancing, paying exorbitant transaction costs to ratchet down their home mortgage rate a few points without regard for the payback period.  I guess there is a pattern there. 

It's a whole new ball game out there.

Young couple in my office Both are Lawyers.  New ones.  Both get paid $60k each.  No Kids yet, but one in the oven.

Combined Student loan debt?  $400k.

They file separate to keep the payments affordable.  They are NEVER going to pay off the student debt.  At $300 a month each, it will never happen.

Difference between Joint and MFS?  $282 between fed and state.

The payments on the student debt would have tripled.

I have two couples like this.  And more to come.

Why get married?

Rich

 

 

[JohnH]

Interesting. Thanks for the perspective.  Guess I need to be on the lookout for something like this. Right after I become an expert on ACA. 

[Jack from Ohio]

23 minutes ago, JohnH said:

Interesting. Thanks for the perspective.  Guess I need to be on the lookout for something like this. Right after I become an expert on ACA. 

There are NO experts on ACA!!  Only us tax professionals who have tried to learn about that extremely destructive, flawed and ridiculous set of INSURANCE laws.  The IRS keeps changing the dates and rules about us enforcing that INSURANCE laws such that there cannot be any EXPERTS (not even in the government) on ACA.

[NECPA in NEBRASKA]

I just finished a return today where I actually told the guy that I had never seen a good reason to smoke before this. If he didn't smoke, the insurance was affordable and he owed approximately an $800 penalty, since he smokes, the insurance was unaffordable and he got to keep his entire refund. He had insurance previously through work, but they dropped it due to ACA.